Coach now on the website, too.
I know have a little Coach above my daily progress. It seems like now only progress overall (and not separately for each language) is tracked.
Anything else you noticed?
some trouble shooting info in these discussions:
True to form, DL adds something, and removes something else to balance it out. I get their concept for that policy (simplify), but this is not always a good thing to do. In fact, it's often not a good thing to do. This is one of those cases, and it's pretty ridiculous.
Beyond that, the inability to remove the goal (as per AlexisLinguist; I haven't tried it, and for this exact type of bug/reason) is also ridiculous, and I'm not sure I see the point in it, anyway. We've already got streaks. Now they're implementing a second type? Maybe to remove the first type? facepalm
Metrics can be misleading, even from lab rats.
Totally agree with you, and it is not only the Coach that I have to admit that in fact I do not like it at all, there is nothing more motivating for me at least see how much more experience do I need to get to the next level, and on the other hand the Coach demands the same experience for all the languages that you are learning, no matter if you do 50 xp just in english, it counts for every languages, so it is done, you get the whole goal at once.
thanks for the info - this is very discouraging........ when they took the vocabulary info away early this year people went crazy and we were promised it would come back.......then we were scolded for months on end whenever anyone asked again when we'd get the word counts and the word lists back.......so now they are taking away the word count..... and the experience points ----- I don't like the coach thing at all and have no interest in setting a daily goal and nagging.......I don't know why they would take away the most basic metrics we have had to track ourselves. - so are they taking away the levels too ? this makes no sense
While I love the idea of the coach and was extremely happy about this event, I find it ridiculous to hold a spot for a so-called "Basic" setting which requires you to have 1 XP point a day. That's nothing as well as pretty difficult to achieve! You must be either very bad at the language or very lazy, wanting or being able to pass only the first question of a timed exercise OR again, you must be very bad the at language or very lazy and go into immersion to translate a single word or click on a "looks good" to gain a single XP. The very moment you finish a diligent practice session you get at least 10 XP which immediately "throws" you to the "Casual" setting...
I would also find it delicate to have an option to set our own goal, because 50 XP a day is still not that insane, considering that it adds up doing different courses (I do three courses, so I have to achieve 16 XP per course which is not really much). Another solution OR an extension for this could be to separate the coach for each course, but that wields the danger of making it unmanageable and incomprehensible for the learner. Perhaps a kind of a summary, or a diary could do the trick which lists all the coaches for today?
EDIT: Besides, before I am considered ungrateful: I LOVE THIS and THANK YOU SO MUCH for adding this feature, it is really cool and well done :)
EDIT2: edited stupid typos and corrected words I spelt wrong. It's late here you know -.-
I wanted to write something similar. 50 xp is pretty normal I guess and nothing impossible to reach. Thus, I would greatly enhance the trainer with levels of 100, 200, 500, 1000 xp. more than 1000 xp would be insane, but there are people who have a tier higher than 3 and use the immersion section intensively and gaining 50 xp a day could mean to translate one sentence a day - and that is clearly not insane!
Maybe they could have a setting for Immersion, because sometimes the only practice people do on a certain langauage is Immersion.
Cool idea - I tried that but after I make the changes to the code, it shows on the page but when I leave the page then the code reverts back to the previous code - is there a compiler or something that needs to be done after the code is changed to save it so it is permanent?
I'm sad they got rid of the ability to build up XP, so that you can keep your Coach's streak even with a low XP in a given day. You used to be able to build up XP during the week, so that you could "slack" on the weekends, while maintaining this streak. I've since given up on the "Coach's streak" and have only cared about the streak presented on the website.
Ultimately, streaks are irrelevant since the point is the learn the language. The Coach's streak used to be a helpful tool to lead towards that goal, but isn't anymore for me. I'm sure they have analytics that show that I'm in the minority, and I understand that, and am cool with it. Just wanted to share my personal history with this.
"Ultimately, streaks are irrelevant since the point is the learn the language."
How is something that encourages consistent practice irrelevant to learning the language? Because the minimum goal truly requires minimal effort?
I didn't realize that Immersion counted towards the streak. If that's the case, does Words?
Oh, gotcha, yes.
One of my workout trackers sends a weekly email summarizing your points for the week, comparing to previous weeks and other users, and challenges you to get x points in the coming week. From a motivational standpoint, I like this. It's clear (quantified), attainable (reasonable increases), socially-constructed (look what others are doing!), and self-centered (you're compared to your previous work).
It also doesn't penalize you for having a lazy week: you don't break a streak, fail to meet a goal, or anything like that. The closest the "coach" comes to shaming you is "this is x points fewer than last week."
I think something like that would be useful. The consistent practice, effort, and interest in improving over the long run are important. What you're doing on a day to day level is less important.
"Why on earth would I want to set a points target rather than a ground covered target?" Agreed. The streak is great for daily "progress" (quotes because some days are five XP), and the bar for overall progress. No thanks, Duolingo, if you don't bring the bar back. Not to mention the redesign before this...
Questions the A/B testing could answer (and thus improve):
What goals are chosen?
How do people interact with the goal and how does their behavior change after setting a goal?
I'm sure there's more, but basically: in the current world of technology development, user testing over short spurts is VERY common. The website user base is not identical to the app user base, and thus the testing.
The nature of the internet and feedback is that negative feedback appear to be more meaningful than positive feedback: more people speak up when they're unhappy, etc. Also, know how people flip out whenever Facebook changes the look and feel...and then a few months later nobody cares? Yes, some changes are legitimately for the worse. But sometimes the change is ultimately neutral, or even positive in light of a specific goal.
I'm not the developer, so I can't speak to what metrics are actually being used. But it sounds like it's a more complicated process than "x% of our users people complained, guess we'll change it back."
How many people are usually in an A/B testing group, because I always seem to be in them. Plus, I would like to say that I miss the XP bar telling me how close I was to the next level. Can it, like translation tiers with the profile page change recently, be re-added due to popular request?
since there seems to be two discussions, I'll type me comment here too:
This seems to be another indicator that duolingo is going the way of 'forcing' everyone into using coach. This has already happen (from what I hear) on the new iPhone app, and you can no longer 'opt out' of coach.
With 1XP needed at the basic level, it really doesn't change anything, but does make things a bit more uniform.
The stats screen looks nice too. I wonder if the "..hours left to go" syncs with your computers clock or your 'duolingo day' clock.
I think it will, but it would probably be more informative if people actually knew what timezone the application placed them under. It can potentially be quite confusing if one suddenly changes timezones and sees a different timer.
Perhaps it could be shown in the settings/account or once hovered.
Could you also clarify whether this is doing away with the original streak and replacing it with the "on track" label?
Damn. I hope DL is not going to go down the route of forcing users to use the site in a presciptive way. As it stands I can currently ignore all the silly games that others seem to find essential to their use of the site. I'm over 50. I DO NOT WANT to be forced to use features intended to motivate 13 year olds at school.
The issue I have with this feature (and as I do not yet have it I am going by what those who do have it have said) is that DL seems to be introducing features that you HAVE to use - regardless of whether they actually motivate you or not and whether you find them helpful or not.
For some people, especially introverts who rely on their own internal, inherent motivation, being told they HAVE to do something or HAVE to use the site in a prescribed way is itself ironically DEmotivating.
I, and no doubt many other users, do not need chivvying up or jollying along to do our daily practice or set externally visible goals. We are motivated to do our daily practice because learning a language is inherently rewarding, both immediately and in the long term.
If DL introduces a toolkit of features and options which the user can use or not as he wishes, then fair enough. We will all use what works for us, but to be forced to use features which do not actually motivate us but make things less pleasant, risks alienating up to half of the site's users.
I think they are just trying to simplify.
It does motivate some users, so those users can set their goal to 30, 40, 50, whatever, but for those who don't like it, they can just set their goal for 1XP and continue on like nothing happen.
(not a fan myself, and actually haven't set a goal yet in protest, but I understand the reasoning)
It seems you're reading too much into it. As it stands it doesn't affect use at all. More importantly there is always a risk with any innovation, which is why Duolingo reduces this risk by A/B testing everything. One can look at it as simply renaming "streak" with "on track".
A rose by any other name can smell just as sweet, and pricks just as well.
P.S. I don't have it yet, and am just going by what I've read about the coach.
I haven't set mine at all. I'm guessing that means I'm auto-set to 1XP. Man... our upcoming gig is going to make this thing look like a mini windfall for the metrics... :( I'm not totally opposed to the couch for the website because it allows for 1XP minimum. But, I am seriously missing my progress between levels bar. :(
My guess would be that this is a semi-revert back to the old streak system when the flame is your overall streak (maintained by 1XP per day in any language) and coach (previously language specific streak) seen on each web page's specific page and maintained by meeting daily goal in each language.
Anybody else having problems with the xp count on the coach? I've did one lesson today, earned 19 pts, and the coach shows me as having over 300xp for today. :/ It's possibly combining the points with yesterday...
Am I missing something? Or should I report this as a glitch?
There was an error changing my coach. I was trying to learn Italian and I hadn't used duolingo for a while so I had set my goal for regular. But when I got back into it I wanted to change my goal. It said, there was an error setting up your coach, try again later. So I refreshed the app. Nothing. I tried again later. Nothing. I tried agin the next day. Nothing. If anybody out there receives this message, please respond with a user friendly answer (I'm not exactly the worlds biggest computer expert.) THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Hi Blue! Go to http://www.duolingo.com/bchan. Let bchan know what is going on. The first note only has room for 300 characters. So, make it short. Underneath it, your next comment can be much longer. Make sure to list what operating system you're using in your message (For example, I'm using Windows7) and what browser you're using (I'm using Chrome, some use Firefox or Navigator etc.). Then, say whether you're using a phone or ipad app, which phone if it's a phone, or the website. If you can take screen print of the error message, go to http://imgur.com and upload the image. Then, right click the image and choose "copy image url" Paste that URL with your message by right clicking on bchan's stream and selecting "paste". If you don't know how to take a screenprint, go to www.youtube.com, put in what operating system and "how to take a screenprint. From there, go to your programs and find the default pain program. Then go to File, then Paste. Save the file to your deskdop for easy findings. Then upload that image to imgur.com
I hope this was understandable. Good luck! I hope all of this gets figured out for you. :)