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"Are the new generations different from the old ones?"

Translation:Le nuove generazioni sono diverse dalle vecchie?

June 26, 2013

84 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Overlordspam

Just a quick question... Why is "Sono le nuove generazioni diverse da quelle vecchie?" not accepted here?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Susannaara2

Because they don't know Italian language... I'm Italian.. It's right to say.. Sono le.....


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mel748099

Thanks, i was also confused.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pierugofoz

@Overlordspam
Grammatically speaking your sentence is correct
However
italians usually ask questions without changing word order

  • Le nuove generazioni sono diverse dalle vecchie
    (The new generations are different from the old ones)
  • Le nuove generazioni sono diverse dalle vecchie?
    (Are the new generations different from the old ones?)

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HelenWalke1

I'd be very interested to know this too. I guess I should do some independent reading, but I find it interesting that in so many languages the conjugated verb comes first in questions, but that this does not appear to be the case in Italian.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RomancePhilology

Actually, marking questions through inversion is rather unusual.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MintySciurus

"Le nuove generazioni sono diverse da quelle vecchie?" is accepted (Feb 2020). Whether the position of sono makes a difference I don't know. I was also hesitant about whether vecchie should go before quelle, or after.
It could just be a variation that the DL volunteers hadn't thought of, so it isn't (or wasn't) included in their database.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Robetino

I just tried this (Oct. 2020) and it was rejected


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/joeybemate

In English we change the word order depending on whether it is a statement or a question (e.g. are you vs you are). In Italian they don't - the word order stays the same.

Putting sono at the front of the sentence doesn't make sense because it wouldn't make sense as a statement.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/German4me22

Word order....Le nuove generazioni sono diverse da quelle vecchie accepted.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/acostaem

Your answer should be correct. In English, you do not say "The new generations are different than the old ones?" And think that by putting a question mark at the end it makes it grammatically correct. Same in Italian "sono" should be at the front of the sentence for it to be a grammaticaly correct question. The English example itself is grammatically correct. I'm at a loss as to why this hasn't been corrected.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SteveKillick

What is wrong with Le generazioni nuove?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MintySciurus

Certain Italian adjectives go before the word they modify.

https://www.thoughtco.com/italian-adjective-order-4098168


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Puzzle36714

It's too random. They should follow a structure.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Marvin861165

Oh that was my question too?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ZuMako8_Momo

As MintySciurus said, certain Italian adjectives go before the word they modify. (S)He/They included this link: https://www.thoughtco.com/italian-adjective-order-4098168


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tikidog

Why is it 'diverse' instead of 'diversi'? Isn't it modifying 'generazioni'?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dnovinc

Yes, it is modifying "le generazioni" which is actually plural form of feminine noun "la generazione", therefore we have diverse.

EDIT: Nouns ending in -e may be masculine or feminine. The gender of these nouns must be memorized.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/stuart.hol2

I think (but I'm just a learner too) that words ending "-zione" are feminine, such as generazione, stazione and televizione?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/StanKing1

Generally, yes, for -ione words. There must be a cheat sheet for this topic somewhere. I have one for French (on paper).

Be careful: televisione doesn't have a Z.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ZuMako8_Momo

That is incorrect, StanKing2. As stuart.hol2 said, «-zione» (and «-sione») words are feminine. However, «-ione» and «-one» words are masculine: «il maglione», «lo ione», «il pedone», etc.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/StanKing1

Good point. Thanks.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/anthony799024

I made a comment below that explains it in a little more detail


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/anthony799024

All italian words ending in -sione or -zione are feminine. Note that some italian words end in -ione but without an "s" or "z" and this rule does not necessarily apply. For instance "rione" (district) is masculine and uses "il" and "ragione" (reason) is feminine, using "la."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/allangottlieb

Is "generazioni nuove" (instead of "nuove generazioni") really wrong?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/QwertyQueer

I honestly am doing the italian test to get some leaderboard points since I'm almost out of ruby league, and I think that "generazioni nuove" sounds better/is used equally (I'm Italian)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/.Flux.

Yes, it is ;) I think it is the same if you write it in English, is it not? "Generations news" sounds totally wrong too...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/.Flux.

Sorry, "generations new".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/allangottlieb

But English almost always puts the adjective before the noun, but italian often puts the noun first. Is nuovo an adjective that normally precedes the noun?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ZuMako8_Momo

There are certain adjectives in Italian that come before nouns; these include all determiners, numbers (quantifiers), and the following adjectives: «vecchio», «nuovo», «grande», and «piccolo».


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tallman69

The order for these types of adjectives are dependant on the emphasis the speaker wishes to convey. In your example of the "old bridge" in Firenze, the emphasis is certainly on the "old." Therefore one would expect the name to be, "Pointe Vecchio." However, you might say, "Dopo la sinistra, passerai sopra un vecchio ponte."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Norma212801

I don't think that's a hard and fast rule, e.g. Ponte Vecchio in Florence is not Vecchio Ponte


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/darkpeak

I want to know this, too. How can we decide when to put the adjective BEFORE the noun?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/StanKing1

You could try to apply the French rule, BAGS: adjectives of beauty, age, goodness, and size go before the noun.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tallman69

Stan, that is brilliant! Thanks for the pneumonic! I actually just got this one wrong for putting "nuove" second. I knew certain adjectives COULD come first. I didn't know they HAD to. And BAGS is a great way to remember which ones. Thanks. I'd throw you a lingot if it gave me the option here.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kysernj

Yes, me too! Nuovo sometimes comes after the noun, doesn't it? So when is it correct to put it before and when after?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/balazs_g

There was a translation for this "old ones" thing earlier which used "quelli". Something like: "...sono diverse dalle quelle di vecchie"...? Could someone make it more precise?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/.Flux.

Maybe you are referring to: "le nuove generazioni sono diverse da quelle vecchie?" or "le nuove generazioni sono diverse dalle vecchie?". It is possible because "generations" are implicit for "the old ones", it is obvious that you are talking about "generations". I don't know if it is more clear, now. Sadly my English is not very good ^^


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MsCobb

Flux, your English is good!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/J-Martinez66

Your English is clear thanks for the explanation :-)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sandsharkattack

Can I phrase this as "Sono diverse le nuove generazioni dalle vecchie?"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ZuMako8_Momo

I don't see why not! :) Italian has much freer word order than English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sandsharkattack

seems like it! thanks :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CharlesPit19

According to my Websters Dictionary, 'diverso/a' is 'different' and 'diverse/i' is 'several.' So, I'm confused on this one. Could someone enlighten me?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pierugofoz

what you say is almost right

  • diverso/a = different

  • diversi/e = different or several (depends on its position)
    ᅳ generazioni diverse = different generations
    ᅳ diverse generazioni = several generations
    ᅳ animali diversi = different animals
    ᅳ diversi animali = several animals


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Cassidy314

Why is it unacceptable to put "nuove" after "generazioni"? I was under the impression that in Italian words like nuovo, bello, grande, etc. could go either before or after the noun.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pierugofoz

yes, in this case you could put the adjective "nuove" before or after "generazioni" and the meaning of the sentence doesn't change.
However, usually a different position corresponds to a different meaning
- ho una bicicletta nuova = I have a new bicycle
- ho una nuova bicicletta = I have another bicycle (it may be new or not)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DouglasWin6

I responded, Sono le nuove generazioni differenti da quelle vecchie? Setting aside the possibility that some correct answers haven't been included, I see at least three differences between my response and the one supplied as correct, and I don't know which one, two, or three of those differences make my response wrong.

Edited to add: After I changed the word order and substituted diverse for differenti, I found that quelle vecchie was accepted in the following response: Le nuove generazioni sono diverse da quelle vecchie?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TanyaBella76

Isn't this more of a statement, than a question??


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pierugofoz

In italian many questions are written like a statement plus a question mark.
In speech the only difference is the intonation, which is more recognizable than Duolingo's


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kristencox

I thought when you were talking about "ones" you needed "quegli". Why is "Le nuove generazioni sono diverse da quegli vecchio" wrong?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/anthony799024

Quel, quei, quegli, quelle, and quella are all demonstrative adjectives that are placed in front of the words to which they refer.

Simply put, in your example, it is attached to the word "vecchio" which firstly should be vecchie. Also, since "quegli" is attached to "vecchie" it should be "quelle."

But even if it were a word that would need "quegli" like "stivali" (boots) it would still only require "quei" to be attached to "vecchi" because the demonstrative adjectives are to compliment the word they are attached to, not the original object.

Your example should be an acceptable way to translate the sentence, however, with the correct suffixes.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BatmansVater

Le nuove generazioni sono diverse dalle vecchie


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Malayer

What's the certain formation of noun and adjective in Italian sentences? "Le generazioni nuove "or " le nuove generazioni "


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ZuMako8_Momo

It should be «le nuove generazione». As MintySciurus said, certain Italian adjectives go before the word they modify. (S)He/They included this link: https://www.thoughtco.com/italian-adjective-order-4098168

Sometimes, adjectival placement can affect meaning: https://www.rocketlanguages.com/italian/grammar/italian-adjectives


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tom420379

generazioni nuove should be accepted


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ZuMako8_Momo

You need the article, but yes


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GGELATO

Can I use "I nuovi generazioni..."?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pierugofoz

"i̶ ̶n̶u̶o̶v̶i̶ ̶g̶e̶n̶e̶r̶a̶z̶i̶o̶n̶i̶" ← WRONG
"generazioni" is a feminine plural noun (sing."generazione")
- la nuova generazione
- le nuove generazioni


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ThomasA.Be

I put "sono diverse le nuove generazioni dalle vecchie?" and it was marked wrong. Is Duolingo being extremely rigid with the word order or would hearing my word order make native speakers bleed from their ears?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ted172966

There are multiple examples where they have used "nuova" after a noun.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RanHinrichs

Sono le nuove generazioni diverse dalle vecchie.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Carrie305547

why not da quelle vecchie? in the last lesson, we had quelli nuovi for the new ones.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MelBN

Could it be "Sono le nuove generazioni diverse dalle vecchie?"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MikioSakam1

I have the same question.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MarcelFolt

Can't it be "differenti" instead of "diverse"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mattfinder

Would "Sono diverse da quelle vecchie le nuove generazioni?" be grammatically correct? It's not currently accepted. Is that because the construction doesn't sound natural?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IvyDean1

I dont like how the correct answers cover up my incorrect ones. I want to see what i had done uncorrectly!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CharlesPit19

IvyDean1, I use DL on a laptop and have not noticed the problem. Perhaps it is peculiar to either the phone or tablet you are using. If you are using a phone, try going to 'settings' and changing the font size. Just guessing, but that might work.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KirstiNitz

SOME WORDS WERE INVISIBLE!!!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KirstiNitz

THE WORDS WERE INVISIBLE!!!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Random543001

Its wrong the way it is one thing is a question ant the other an answer...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Line947322

Why is it not generazioni diversi?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Norma212801

La generazione is feminine. Feminine words that end in "e" are made plural by changing the "e" to "i" but they are still feminine and use feminine adjectives, so Le generazioni diverse.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/R.J.Petril

Generazione nuove was marked incorrect. Perche?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ZuMako8_Momo

As Norma212801 says above in response to Line947322, feminine nouns (and masculine nouns) that end in «e» in the singular become plural by changing the «e» to «i»


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/R.J.Petril

Generazioni nouve was marked wrong, perche?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Norma212801

nuove, not nouve. Sometimes it will say "you have a typo" and not mark it wrong, sometimes not.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ZuMako8_Momo

Also, don't forget the article «le» before «generazioni nuove»

*Perché


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ReinderBak

What ;s wrong with Le nuove generazioni sono diverse dalle vecchie?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ZuMako8_Momo

Nothing; that's the exact answer


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CamSawConquered

why italians questions never sound like ones?

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