"Vedo il tuo cappello fra i vestiti."
Translation:I see your hat among the dresses.
61 CommentsThis discussion is locked.
The difference between tra and fra is similar to the differences of 'among' and 'between,' but apparently they use them almost interchangeably. They avoid using 'tra' with another word that has 'tr' such as 'i tra tre' (among/between the three) and would instead say 'i fra tre.' According to a dictionary I read (link below) this is because it sounds better and avoids confusing phrases like 'i tra tra,' 'i fra fra,' and 'i fra fro.' http://dizionari.corriere.it/dizionario-si-dice/T/tra-fra.shtml
Thank you for the clear explanation but I still don´t know why I lost a heart after using "fra i vestiti"
I don't know when you posted your question, but in March 2016 the answer given is “FRA i vestiti“. People always say “languages live“ and therefore change. Now DL certainly lives that motto.
Not that is changing. Duo sometimes correct their mistakes. But many of them are still there, no matter the comments...
Youre supposed to click the flag button and report it; they dont rely on the discussions part for that
I still don't understand that either. The only theory I have is that perhaps 'fra' is also avoided with 'v.'
If anyone knows the answer to that please fill us in.
At least in my question it was a listening exercise -- even if what you put was right, if it isn't what they said then it's wrong. That's how Duo works
My native italian teacher said it was only a difference in style, not in meaning. It is the same word. Your suggestion makes sense, and would be something a native/natural speaker might not see.
I used tra instead of fra and got it marked wrong. Everything else was fine. Would love to know why.
The first thing I looked for. Checked and double checked. No other issues
Then, they have changed something as both were accepted before.
Not nice, leaving us with no explanation
Sounds like a line from a song about a relationship! I see your hat between the dresses I see your sleepy smile in the morning sun You're the milk in my coffee cup, I gotta confesses! You make-a me get up up up - and all day for you I'll run!
That's really lovely. If those are your words you should write more songs. Or is it a tune that Chico Marx used to sing?
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Keep writing. Suggested edit. Replace line 2 with: I'll be the cream in your coffee cup. That was a 5 years ago. I'd be interested to see how your writing has progressed.
When are "Fra" and "Tra" supposed to be used correctly? I can never tell when I'm supposed to write either one
I am not completely sure, but you use the one that sounds better with the next word. Fra Fratelli will be incorrect.
I am English and speak fluent Italian and am checking out Duo Italian for a friend who eventually wants to use it. When you have to translate : "vedo un cappello fra i vestiti" the correct translation would be: " I can see a hat among your clothes". This is because when it is a case of perception in English you have to say I can see. All things considered Duo Italian is not too bad but there is certainly room for improvement.
Ciao a tutti e buon divertimento con la lingua italiana !!!
Tina Wardle
No, you don't have to say it, but it is possible and should be allowed on all applicable questions on this course. This explains when and why it's used:
With verbs of ‘inert perception’ and ‘inert cognition’… there is little difference between being able to do something and actually doing it, so can tends to lose its distinctive modal meaning… With ‘verbs of inert perception’, furthermore, can not only loses its distinctive modal value, but has the additional special function of denoting a state rather than an event. As the Simple Present of these verbs has only an ‘instantaneous’ event meaning… the main difference between… I can see and I see is one of perception as a state versus perception as a (momentary) event
Geoffrey Leech, 'Meaning and the English Verb'
It could be left out in a present tense narrative ("I see your hat… then leave"), in a description of a repeated event ("I see your hat… every day"), and Americans often leave it out in all kinds of sentences.
Could this sentence be used in a context such as:
A) "Have you seen my hat?" B) "Hmm, let's check the pile of clothes on the floor. Aha! I see your hat between the dresses."
I said "I see your hat among the clothing" and it was correct. Could someone explain why DobbieWalk was wrong and I was right, because I have no clue.
I think because it views "Clothing" and "Clothes" as different when they really mean the same thing
It's possible that DL hasn't accepted the use of 'amongst' yet, if you flag it I'm sure they'll look into it.
In reply to Calbr's comment above, did you spell 'cappello' correctly? 'capello' translates as 'hair' and you may have lost a heart for that instead of 'fra I vestiti'...?
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If vestiti can be dresses, clothes or suits, why is i see your hat between the suits not accepted?
the lesson right before this one used i vestiti to mean clothes, so I said that,but now DL wants it to mean dresses and marked me wrong!!! errrg!
I'm not sure, but I think it's just a matter of American vs British English. Duo doesn't accept "whilst" either
I'm so glad to see Duolingo has improved so much since I last used it! I don't have to type something like "between the clothes" to get by! Or maybe just the Italian section happens to be better than the French one... You used to have to write ridiculous things in order to not lose hearts, just to be able to get to the coveted next lesson.
I have just realized that I wrote " I can see a hat among your clothes" instead of "the clothes"
Vedo il tuo capello fra i vestiti. I literally had every word right and got it marked wrong.
Generally, Duo will flag a misspelling as a typo, unless the misspelling is a valid other word.
Your sentence says "I see your HAIR among the dresses" caPello = hair caPPello = hat
TO MOST PEOPLE ASKING WHY THEIR ANSWER WAS WRONG: Cappello is with two p’s (with one p it means hair). Fra and tra are both correct and accepted. It is a very easy mistake to make and hard to see what you did wrong!
If I happened to use tra in this sentence would it sound off to a native speaker or would that be acceptable?
What I don' t understand is why they consider a mistake "I CAN see" in the English translation. I think it is more correct than "I see". Besides, it is not the English language and its varieties we are here for. I use British English and I am pretty sure that my version is 100% correct.
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This rejected my translation of cappello as 'cap' saying it should be 'hat'. The drop down translations when hovering over the word include both hat and cap.
When you offer an option to use both dresses and clothing in the same phrase do NOT penalise for the use of EITHER word. VERY frustrating.
There is a contextual conundrum here. Given that the speaker has seen their colleagues/partners/wife's hat surely the dresses it is amongst must belong to the person observed to be requiring that hat. Or else the whole phrase has less meaning than usual with D/L. Given that the dresses belong to the person looking for their hat it should not be incorrect to state that the "hat is seen among your dresses."
Why cannot 'Cap' be accepted instead of 'Hat' for Cappello, with all other words being in proper place?
Could someone please explain why " I see your hat among the clothes" is not correct?
Why is 'I see your hat amongst the clothes' wrong? Isn't that what vestiti more commonly means