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- Topic: Italian >
- "Sto sentendo voci positive."
60 Comments
Schizophrenia can actually be more positive in non-western countries: https://braindecoder.com/post/voice-hearing-experience-in-schizophrenia-may-vary-from-one-culture-to-1381850145
Quanto sei fortunato che la tua schizofrenia ti fa sentire solo voci positive!
422
Agree, even hearing positive voices can be a negative sign! Thinking hypomania as well as schizophrenia ...
- 1835
The verb hear in English is a non action verb - we should not use it in the ing form.
- 120
Agreed. I'm going to start reporting it. Previously, I had: "Stiamo tutti credendo in te.". which was very nicely translated as: "We all believe in you." But here Duo has taken the literal road.
Hi, Susanna
There's an English grammar rule that says that verbs of state (ie not action) don't get used in the continuous form.
For example - you automatically said - it's not usual.
You probably would not think of saying - 'It is not being unusual'.
You DO hear second language speakers say sentences like this, and you can see them as charming (or not) depending on your view of the world. (I go with charming.)
The problem is, the rule is not 100% perfect, tough to pin down, differs between the UK and the US , and is being eroded by usage. [McDonald's 'I'm loving it' has a lot to answer for ... :) ]
In this example, hear/hearing both sound fine to me - but a quick rummage around in Google would give you sites where they would be unhappy with 'hearing'.
I don't think there's one easy answer, but it won't stop people taking sides and getting heated. So I'm running for cover right now.
Have a super day. :)
LindaB: Thanks for a really thought-provoking comment. I've never thought about it in that way and am not sure there aren't exceptions but I nevertheless like your answer -- and the time you took to post it! Worthy of at least one lingot.
Hi, G
I am in hiding, and will not be tempted out, not even for Lingots ....
[I agree! I am not sure there aren't exceptions ... which means, I guess, that I think there may be exceptions .... ]
I just Googled 'verbs of state continuous' and got:
Stative Verbs - Perfect English Grammar www.perfect-english-grammar.com/stative-verbs.html Some English verbs, which we call state, non-continuous or stative verbs, aren't used in continuous tenses (like the present continuous, or the future continuous) ...
That's only the first entry!
YET - I am hearing voices - sounds fine to me. (Ignoring the fact that the speaker may be possessed by demons.)
I am running back into hiding, and taking my Lingot with me.
:) :)
LindaB: I'd be lying if I said I'm not enjoying this continuous discussion.Have another lingot!
- 64
Hi, Linda B! One small question---if YOU'RE hearing voices, wouldn't YOU be the one possesed? BTW, where are you from? I don't think I've ever heard anyone use the word "wainscotting" outside the pages of a book. I'm guessing England. ( Don't worry, I'm not after you. Have another lingot! Mwahahahahahaa! ) Don't mind me---I threw my back out and the dr gave me something for pain AND a muscle relaxant. I'll probably be the next one hearing voices! I just hope they're positive. =:O (Trying to hide inside my guitar case-----they'll never find me there!)
For rcpjenn
Ya got me! North of England. Manchester, many moons ago.
Guitar case! Now you've got my interest. When I was a teenager (back while the earth was still cooling) that would have made my ears prick up. Acoustic? (Please say yes.)
Have a good one. :)
Hullo, G
Stop giving me Lingots! I feel like a mouse being tempted out of the wainscoting with cheese ....
[I can't tell who's talking to me in this stream anymore. If I'm ignoring any comments aimed directly at me, I apologise.]
To be clear - If you attend a TEFL course (English as foreign language) you will get this rule carved into your anatomy. Lots of people think it came down the mountain with Moses.
I am not sticking up for it. I cannot justify it. It is not my opinion. I think it's a vast over-simplification of the rules. I was just replying to Susanna's 'Why not?' because I knew what JoseMaryStrauss was talking about. Just trying to be helpful, not taking sides.
Now I AM going back under the couch.
G - we shall meet again. We'll always have ... well, I'll always have your Lingot.
I'm off. :)
- 120
And to every rule, as we all know, there are exceptions. "I'm loving you." was around before McD picked it up.
How about "I'm seeing a shrink because I'm hearing voices." that works.
You might say: "I know I'm being silly..." Whoops, there's the verb to be in continuous and not wrong.
"She's appearing in a new film." "I'm imagining what you'd look like with a mohawk."
Languages are evolving all the time. Although I agree Duo's choice here is not optimal. It should be reported which I did some time ago but haven't had feedback yet. Have you reported it? It's the best way to get things fixed.
Hallo, Jaye
I'm being silly - doesn't mean I AM silly - it means 'I am behaving in a silly way' - that's an active use of the verb.
Seeing a shrink - consulting - active. Appearing and imagining are both active.
I'm sorry if that sounds like a trick, but it's a documented part of the grammar rule.
This debate got heated on another question where 'I am liking' came up.
Strictly speaking, I like is stative, and the rule says - I like, not I am liking. It sounds fine to me both ways.
I've never completely understood why 'liking' is stative but 'enjoying' is classified as an action verb. (I like this. I am enjoying it.)
There are loads of examples out there where the rule is clearly broken, but the English sounds completely fine. God help the poor second-language speaker.
:)
Hi Linda
Really enjoyed this thread:)
You said: "God help the poor second language speakers" Well luckily the good old BBC have stepped in to save Him the trouble
http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/learningenglish/grammar/learnit/learnitv120.shtml
This gives a workable version of the rule. Essentially, it says that if a stative verb (which normally describes something continuous) is used to describe something with a beginning and an end, then the progressive 'ing' form becomes possible.
Applying this definition to "I'm loving it" suggests that the infatuation with the burger may be short lived! Maggie
LindaB: I've read so many of these now that I'm starting to hear voices...and they're all telling me to skip this sentence next time through...which frankly I be considering. :)
Good on you, Baggie! Have a Lingot!
OK to use it in the continuous if the time span is finite. Excellent! Hadn't heard that. My sincere thanks - for that and the site.
Chortle. re the burger - if 'Super Size me' is to be believed, your relationship with a burger is a long one. You eat it, then you wear it. :)
Have a fabulous day.
:) :)
My problem with "I'm loving you" isn't the grammar, it's that I keep hearing Ray Charles say "I can't stop loving you." American English is a rich source of these verbs that aren't supposed to be gerunds.
"Being" has a whole different context than hearing, hating, loving, liking, etc. But even then, it would not be unusual to hear something like "You are being stubborn," or "you are being stupid." I never in all my life (and they used to actually teach grammar in the public schools when I was a kid) ever heard of there being (oops! I just used it naturally) an exception to certain verbs having gerunds.
The difference is context. I hear positive (or good voices) is a general statement, but "I am hearing good voices" means right now. In general, we would use the simple present for both of these instances, but we would use the present progressive to clarify if we needed to.
- 422
Agee with JOrlando3: Yes, to listen is active (we listen to the radio) and to hear is passive (we hear the dog bark even if we're not really trying to); however, "right now I am hearing voices" [without actively trying to listen to them] - ie present continuous tense [= present progressive] sounds fine to my ears! Alternative: "Right now I can hear voices." [Other times I can't.] Don't worry, the voices will probably cease soon anyway once they get the meds right!
it's the female plural form...
in Italian some adjectives end -e in the singular and -i in the plural
- grande / grandi
but most of the adjectives have both a masculine/female form in the singular and in the plural
- bello/bella/belli/belle
and this is also the case with "positivo"
- positivo/positiva/positivi/positive
I presume that you have this misunderstanding because the word "voci" seems to be a masculine word, but it isn't. it's irregular:
- la voce / le voci
- 64
Thanks, Sandra. You always come up with simple, clear, easy to understnd answers. I'm on my cell, or I'd send you some well deserved lingots!
My slightly cynical side is picturing a person in a white coat with VERY long arms talking earnestly to a medical professional... "but I am hearing POSITIVE voices, doc! They are no longer urging me to kill people"
It means that you hear positive opinions about something. (maybe in a discussion)
Grazie, Sandra, come sempre.
I am hearing positive 'noises' ... cosa ne dici?
:)
I'm sure it's all correct in English - at least American English, but I can understand that it can indeed be different in other languages, because people who speak different languages often think differently, and their language no doubt influences their thinking - also, their thinking influences their language; I doubt that there's such a thing as a completely static language.
Hi, Susanna
re: I am hearing ...
That sounds perfectly OK to me. I agree unreservedly. It's counter to the 'rule', but it sounds completely fine.
I would NOT say - it is sounding fine. You can see what the guys who put the rule together are getting at ... but it's so much more complicated than it appears at first.
Being facetious - does not break the rule. When 'being' is used to mean 'acting in a certain way' - that's a action verb. It's no longer counted as a verb of state.
Similarly, 'seeing' the doctor - means consulting, visiting - again, here, 'see' is not being used as a verb of state, but as an action verb.
And that's only the very first in a long line 'ah, but ...!' provisos.
It's a complicated, flawed rule... be glad you grew up with the language and didn't have to deal with it.
:)
"I be facetious" - now that sounds natural, doesn't it? Wouldn't anyone say "I am being facetious"?
It is a pity that this enlightening and very useful comment is hidden after other not so relevant discussions. It would be much clearer if the translation to English used "opinions" instead of "voices", as the latter is not used in this context.
Kriska...I can imagine a situation where a group of people are expressing their opinions loudly and the moderator might say that. If that doesn't satisfy, there's always a seance!
I don't think I would. I can't imagine a place where I would use this sentence. But at least I can say it in Italian.
Over a year of DL and i still don't know whether or when to use "sto" or "io sono" for "I am"
Brief explanation: https://www.mytutor.co.uk/answers/7355/A-Level/Italian/What-is-the-difference-between-the-verbs-essere-and-stare/
Bottom line on this unit: you always use "stare" with the gerund.
Sto leggendo. Stai mangiando. Sta pensando.
Stiamo entrando. State ascoltando. Stanno cominciando.
How does one report a bad translation, or a nonsense sentence, if they don't give you a box to comment? There is nothing grammatically wrong with the Italian, or the English, but you would only be likely to come across a sentence like this if you were at a seance, or talking to someone with schizophrenia, or in India.
The dictionary hint for "positive" has "good" yet "I am hearing good voices" is marked incorrect.
I have decided that there is no point in trying to understand Duo's sentences, just translate the words as they are. The last few questions have been simply too odd.
