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  5. "Tills du hittar den."

"Tills du hittar den."

Translation:Until you find it.

December 9, 2014

51 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/bapt.js

What's the difference between "tills" and "förrän", if any?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Zmrzlina

Tills refers to something happening up until a certain point, but förrän is paired with a preceding inte and refers to something being possible to do from a certain point onwards.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Andy979623

Could you provide an example sentence for both please? I'm not sure I full understand the difference.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Zmrzlina

Jag ska leta tills jag hittar den = I will be looking until I find it
In this sentence, we're talking about the fact that I will be continuing to look for something until certain criterion (me finding it) is met. I will then stop looking.

Jag ska inte gå förrän jag hittar den = I will not leave until I find it
In this sentence, we're talking about a future action (me leaving) that will begin to happen once the same criteron as above is met (me finding it). I will leave as soon as I find it.

The difference is thus whether the action stops or starts when the criteria are met. Does that make it clearer?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Uyterschout

Man you're fast. There is no reply button under your last post so I use the one under your former comment (and give myself a like-point for the correct order).

It's perfectly clear to me now that “förrän” is never by itself, but needs “inte” or a other negating word.

In my second example, would it be correct Swedish if 'förrän' is replaced by 'innan'?

Jag ska leta innan jag går - I will be looking before I leave


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Zmrzlina

Yes, that sentence is perfectly fine.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Uyterschout

I'm not sure. Is it 'förrän' if you can replace 'until' with 'before'? Like:

Jag ska leta tills jag går - I will be looking until I leave

Jag ska leta förrän jag går - I will be looking before I leave

Thanx anyway.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Zmrzlina

So your post made me look back on this and realise a mistake on my part. "Förrän" is paired with "inte" meaning "not until". That should probably make it clearer.


[deactivated user]

    What does ska mean?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MonikaPutr1

    It's used in future tense


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lostdrewid

    I assume it's okay that the verb isn't in the second position because this is just a sentence fragment?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Lundgren8

    ”Tills” here is a conjunction and after conjunctions the normal word order apply, just as you would say ”Du hittar den.” (You find it.)


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jaiirapetjan

    With all due respect, a conjunction is a word that joins together sentences, clauses, phrases, or words. 'Tills' is a preposition here. Click here for Tyda.se'e definition. Edit: You are right, and I apologize. See following comments. :)


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN

    Yes, "Until" or "Tills" in this lesson is not a preposition. What do you think was the object of the preposition? The clause "you find it" follows "until" and the clause "du hittar den" follows "tills" here. I know that "until" can be either a preposition or a conjunction, but the dictionary that you are using does not acknowledge that, nor for the Swedish. https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/tills

    The preposition in Swedish is "till". https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/till http://www.ordklasser.se/preposition.php

    The following better dictionary recognizes "tills" as a conjunction.

    http://g3.spraakdata.gu.se/saob/

    Perhaps it is important to note that this is not a complete sentence and in such a situation the conjunction introduces a clause. There is not a rest of sentence for it to connect that clause to.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jaiirapetjan

    You are right. We could imagine the whole sentence as, "Let's not leave until you find it." Then it's clear it is a conjunction. Thanks for clarifying. I just edited my comment, which had 25 upvotes in October of 2016 anyway!


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zorrolunas

    When should one use "tills" instead of "till"?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kikikii

    "Tills" means until and "till" means "to". I'm going to the restaurant = Jag går till restaurangen.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/irisschaffer

    Wait, what? I thought in that case you'd use "på" (Jag går på restaurang)


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Arnauti

    If you want to say that you walk to a certain restaurant, you say Jag går till restaurangen. If you want to say that you go to a restaurant in order to eat, you say Jag går på restaurang.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/asceel.hab

    What's the difference between att finna and att hitta?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JoakimEk

    They mean the same. Hitta is more commonly used.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Laski-Julle

    Why is "until you find that" wrong?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Zmrzlina

    That'd be tills du hittar den där/det där.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Zmrzlina

    En-words and ett-words respectively.

    When a dummy pronoun is used (formal subject), as in det regnar ("it rains"), it's always det.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/alexwooty

    That's what I thought... but then why is it 'den' rather than 'det' in this sentence, when we don't know what the 'it' is that's being referred to? If the gender is unknown, we should use 'det', right?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Zmrzlina

    The sentence is actually ambiguous about the grammatical gender of the object in question, so here both den and det are correct.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/alexwooty

    Thanks, so if we are are talking about 'it' as the subject, it defaults to det if the gender is ambiguous, but if we are talking about 'it' as a subject and the gender is ambiguous, as in this sentence, we can use either gender?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Yerrick

    I think in most cases like this, the gender will be known, because we're referencing some specific noun from the last (or a recent) sentence.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Soasamuel

    the first one is accusative, the second one is nominative


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Yamese4

    where did hittar come from?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Zmrzlina

    What do you mean?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Yamese4

    i don't remember hittar in the lessons


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Zmrzlina

    Perhaps you didn't encounter it earlier. The lessons randomize what words are being taught, and thus there is a possibility that one word here and there might not be appear in it's designated lessons if you brushed though it quite fast.

    But well, you learned it now! :)


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/gabrielarangel

    Why is the V2 rule not applied in this case?? :/


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Arnauti

    It's not a complete sentence.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Yerrick

    "Tills du hittar det." is not a valid translation of this sentence?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Zmrzlina

    It is. If it's not accepted, please report it and send a screenshot to the devs.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DanBeast666

    3 years later and it still shows as an error


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/bepisTM

    I hear tills with a k or kv, instead of a t. Anyone hearing the same?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Zmrzlina

    Sounds like a T to me, but it's a bit too explosive perhaps...


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tamarair

    When do we use tills and when do we use förrän??


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RAlberdi

    See Zmrzlina's answer at the beginning.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PaleBloodMoon

    Hmm if you hover over "den" it translates to "it" "the" and "the one." What context would you use the last translation in? Interpreting the sentence as "Until you find the one." is incorrect.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JosVictorA7

    They said "Förrän" comes with an "Inte". But can "Tills" come with en "inte" too? Like: Jag ska inte åker tills du hitter det"


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HelloMiners

    Why wouldn't we use the V2 for this? Like "Tills hittar du den?"


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dan181291

    No, because "tills du hittar den" is a subclause. In the subclause, the V2 rule doesn't apply.

    Imagine the full sentence, it could be something like "Vi ska stanna här tills du hittar den."

    Words like inte and gärna, for example, come before the verb in the subclause, unlike in the main clause (because of the V2 rule). So, for example, "Jag ska gå inte om inte du kommer" meaning "I'm not going if you don't come."

    And if you just asked me a question like "Ska du gå?" I may just answer "Nej, om inte du kommer," meaning "No, unless you come." or "No, if you don't come." I like how the structure is similar to older English... "I shall go not if not you come..."

    BTW, I'm a Swedish learner myself, so I could be wrong here! I'm sure someone will correct if I'm completely wrong (always possible)


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Aniklol

    Would "Tills du hittar det" also be an acceptable sentence?

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