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  5. "Is leatsa an portán."

"Is leatsa an portán."

Translation:The crab is yours.

December 11, 2014

63 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/michelleplus8

What is this -sa being added to words? I read that it's for emphasis? What does it mean, and did I miss some explanation of it? I spent forever trying to figure out which pronoun was sa before I realized it was leat + sa.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Cait48

Scroll down to the bottom of this link http://www.bitesizeirishgaelic.com/blog/i-me-he-him/ for the emphatic forms of le+ pronoun.

In general, though, be prepared to see a -se (mise), -sa (tusa), etc (complete list:http://nualeargais.ie/gnag/person.htm) to put emphasis on a pronoun instead of saying the word more forcefully. The preposition + pronoun construction often has special forms, too, like liomsa and leatsa.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Desiree29977

"Tusa" just makes me think of JarJar...the good news, at least, is that I won't forget it now


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/michelleplus8

Also, is, "Is leat an portán" actually wrong, or just not emphatic?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Cait48

I don't think it's wrong, per se, but I can't come up with a situation where you would want to tell someone that the crab is theirs without some sort of emphasis. I have the same problem with a lot of sentences on Duolingo.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dim-ond-dysgwr

I think it's leatsa because of the implied contrast: i.e. it's yours (not mine / not hers / etc.). Think of the "tune" of an English sentence like "The lobster's mine but the crab's yours"; how it emphasizes the last word. This is done in Irish with the addition of an "emphatic particle", -sa.

I'd say that is leat is more likely to be used where the emphasis is more on the "what" than the "whose" -- especially in a list. The only example I can think of for the moment is from the Bible, Psalm 47: The day is thine, the night also is thine = Is leat an lá agus is leat an oíche.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PaddyIreland15

This was such a wonderful explanation!!! Thank you for the link, Cait48!

http://www.bitesizeirishgaelic.com/blog/i-me-he-him/


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kelan585200

Leatsa is a word in its own right meaning yours liomsa would be mine.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/19O492554

leatsa isn't a word in it's own right, it's just an intensified version of leat.

Is leat an portán is grammatically correct as well, but is not normally used.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/walgen

is there some association between crabs and ireland


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/scilling

Yes — the former are eaten in the latter.


[deactivated user]

    Couldn't have said it better!


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/joshuaburrow

    Paul (who's in the fridge with his wife) probably has a crab.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Knocksedan

    The association is with portach (bog). Portán is there to make you pay more attention so that you don't mix up bog and crab.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/J0W3x

    what is a bog?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/J0W3x

    Thank you :D !


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/19O492554

    I think the portán exercises are used to contrast with portach, to remind people to pay attention to the whole word, rather than seeing a word that starts with port and assuming that it means "bog".


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Conchubhar1987

    No. Absolutely no association! I have found the persistence of crabs in these lessons very strange too!


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/bookrabbit

    funnily enough some of my clearest memories of Ireland involve crabs!


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Timmo

    Irish speaking regions are generally on the west coast. You might have noticed rón and iasc turned up too. Whether this is conscious or not I can't tell you. portán has taught me lots about lenition and eclipsis, I guess that's why it turns up all the time.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Andrew_Daley

    is bportán correct here?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Cait48

    That depends on the sentence. The sentence I see on the page is Is leatsa an portán In this case, bportán would not be possible, since the article an (the) doesn't change masculine nouns like portán. If you had a sentence where you wanted to say your crab--like Your crab is on the table, you could say do phortán (to one person) or bhur bportán (to two or more people).


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/peegemac

    Could this sentence also translate like "It's your crab"?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/scilling

    No — that would be Is é do phortán é.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/legatrix

    I don't fully understand why "é" occurs twice in your example?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/scilling

    An identificational copular statement with a third-person pronoun as the subject can’t have the copula directly adjacent to its complement; the first é is a “subcomplement” that provides that separation. Think of it as approximately “It’s that, your crab.”, with the first é corresponding (non-literally) to “that”.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/daithi23

    I don't doubt your grammar but would you use that sentence normally or would native speakers shorten it? It sounds awkward..


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/B-mhongoadh

    I'm not a native speaker, and very far from becoming fluent - but, with due respect, I don't find the phrase awkward- you'll find the rhythm echoed in some dialects ( if that helps) - "it's your crab (so) it is" - " it's your crab, hey." I found this helped me a bit when trying to get my head round some of the constructions and how they might be varied.


    [deactivated user]

      Is é is commonly contracted to so you might hear Sé do phortán é.

      There is an Irish song whose chorus begins Sé mo laoch mo ghile mear.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/scilling

      That is the normal structure for an identificational copular statement with a third-person pronoun as the subject, so that’s how I’d use it. I’m not a native Irish speaker, though, so you’ll need to find some to ask to find out if they’d shorten it — my guess is that a native speaker would probably pronounce it as ’Sé do phortán é.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HannahEire2

      Why does do get a h with portán to make it do phortán but leatsa portán does not They are both the second pronoun in the list of pronouns used.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/19O492554

      Singular possessive adjectives cause lenition. do is a possessive adjective.

      leatsa is not a possessive adjective.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ballygawley

      March 2015 "It is your crab" is accepted as correct. I was certain it would be marked an error, because the "an" / "the" was not included in the accepted translation.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NancyAnn11

      I think portan is a very useful word since I can't wait to go to Ireland and enjoy my favorite meal!


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/19O492554

      Note that the crab served in Irish restaurants is likely to be the brown crab, not the blue crab more common in the Eastern and southern US.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Taurendil

      So can this also be translated as 'you own the crab'? Or is there another way to say that?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/scilling

      Yes, it could also be translated as “You own the crab”.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Taurendil

      Go raibh maith agat!


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JohnORiordan

      What is thine? Im a native English speaker and I've never heard it before?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Cait48

      It's an archaic second-person singular possessive--in other words, 'your.' In theory, 'thy' was used before consonants and 'thine' before vowels. Shakespeare wrote (in that famously misunderstood line from Hamlet), 'To thine own self be true.'

      Where did this question come from? I find some of Duolingo's sentences unnatural, but not to the extent of using 'thine'!


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JohnORiordan

      It was in the android app. It translated this sentence to "The crab is thne."


      [deactivated user]

        Thou, thee, thine, old forms for second person still found in prayers: Our Father, Who art in Heaven, hallowed be Thy name; Thy Kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in Heaven.


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/morcant7

        Why is crab spelled differently this time


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Cait48

        Differently from what?

        Portán is the basic form, the one you would find in a dictionary. Sometimes (like after mo and do) there is a séimhiú on the word, which is then spelled phortán. At other times (like after ár or bhur) there is an urú on the word, which is then spelled bportán.

        Lots more info: http://www.nualeargais.ie/gnag/lenition.htm and http://www.nualeargais.ie/gnag/eklipse.htm


        [deactivated user]

          It is all explained in the notes we may read at the beginning of each new topic.


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Leprechaun61

          Thine was correct English about three or four hundred years ago!


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Leprechaun61

          There is a joke about scratching your head and crabs


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LeighaRJE

          It told me the correct answer was "the crab is thine" :D but it would accept "yours"


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ShelbyTemple

          Why not "is leatsa an phortan"?


          [deactivated user]

            portán is a masculine noun.


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Christine386

            What's up with all of the crab examples? Is there some special significance of crabs in Irish culture? Is it just a good example word that inflects predictably? The preponderance of crabs in this course has me scratching my head.


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Cait48

            Duolingo uses a VERY limited vocabulary, and 'portán' can illustrate both séimhiú (phortán) and urú (bportán), so I guess it seemed useful.


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Knocksedan

            It's also easy to confuse portán with portach which is used in some other exercises, so it's a useful reminder that words that look similar aren't necessarily related.


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/StephenLov17

            Why not: Yours is the crab‽


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Knocksedan

            Because Is le X an Y is how you say "the Y is Xs".

            Is le Pól é - "it is Pauls"
            Is liomsa é - "it is mine"
            is leatsa é - "it is yours"
            is leisean é - "it is his"
            Is linne e - "it is ours"
            Is le Pól an portán - "ithe crab is Pauls"
            is liomsa an portán - "the crab is mine"
            is leatsa an portán - "the crab is yours"
            is leisean an portán - "the crab is his"
            is linne an portán - "the crab is ours"

            Is é an portán an cheann s'agatsa is one way that you might say "yours is the crab"


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MaryCoughl7

            How can I figure out that portán is masculine and therefore doesn't get a 'b' in front of it.


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Cait48

            There are some general rules about determining gender of nouns, but I don't know what/if Duolingo teaches you anything about that. Failing any sort of instruction on that, you can look up a word in a dictionary. The dictionary will tell you the gender of the noun. https://www.teanglann.ie/en/fgb/port%C3%A1n

            However, the sentence asks for 'the crab.' Even if you had a feminine noun in this sentence, you wouldn't add a b. The crab is yours --> Is leatsa an portán. (Portán is masculine.) The blanket is yours --> Is leatsa an phluid. (Pluid is feminine.)

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