1. Forum
  2. >
  3. Topic: Irish
  4. >
  5. "Táim chun glaoch a chur ar n…

"Táim chun glaoch a chur ar na daoine."

Translation:I am going to call the people.

December 15, 2014

21 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Flying_Frenchman

Can someone explain to me the role of "chur" in this sentence?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/galaxyrocker

It's the verbal noun of cuir, the verb for "put". Here, it's just another way of expressing "call" (Put a call on someone).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Flying_Frenchman

Oh okay, good to know. Grma!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Fabitorti

I saw on teanglann.ie that the structure Táim chun + verbal noun could be translated as I intend to.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/scilling

Yes, “I am going to …” here means “I intend to …”.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FeargalMcGovern

Does the use of 'chur' (put) infer that a request is being made of the people? as in to say, some kind of responsibilty is being put on them to act?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/scilling

No — glaoch a chur might be better interpreted literally as “to place a call” in English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kincora58

Cén fath nach nglactar leis an bhfoirm scartha: tá mé?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Knocksedan

Is féidir leat an fhoirm scartha a úsáid, más fearr leat


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kincora58

is fearr liom, ach níor glacadh leis!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Knocksedan

Is é an fhoirm tháite an réamhshocrú ar Duolingo.

Is féidir leat tuairisc a thabhairt do Duolingo, agus b'fhéidir gur áireoidh said é.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kincora58

Rinne mé amhlaidh. Míle buiochas


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SatharnPHL
Mod
  • 1439

I thought that "chun" requires the genitive?

Should this not be "Táim chun glaoigh a chur ar na daoine"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MahoganyGaspipe

In most cases chun does take the genitive. However, expressions of intention, as here, are an exception, in which it usually takes the common (nominative) form.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SatharnPHL
Mod
  • 1439

I note that GnaG hedges its bets slightly on that point - "after chun here, mostly no genitive", and provides the example of "chun an fhírinne a rá", but the FGB offers both the nominative and genitive versions of that phrase - "chun an fhírinne, na fírinne, a rá", "to tell the truth".

So it sounds like "Táim chun glaoigh a chur ar na daoine" wouldn't necessarily be wrong (at least for some Irish speakers), but "Táim chun glaoch a chur ar na daoine" is not a problem.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MahoganyGaspipe

What underlies this is the functional genitive, where a noun functions as a genitive but remains in the common/nominative form.

There are a number of cases where this happens, one of which is the subject or object of a verbal noun in the construction subject/object + a + verbal noun. In "chun glaoch a chur", glaoch functions as a genitive, satisfying chun's need for the genitive, but retains the common form.

Another case is a verbal noun that directly follows chun when expressing purpose, e.g. "Táim chun glaoch ar na daoine". There are exceptions to this case that may explain why GnaG seems to hedge.

This is covered well in the Christian Brothers' grammar books. I don't see why FGB gives "chun na fírinne a rá", but even if glaoigh could be correct here, I would want a good reason (such as dialect) to go against the advice of the Christian Brothers' grammar. Therefore, I think glaoch is at least preferable.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/joanmvanore

In another ex, I think someone said that "cur glaoch" should only be intransitive, i.e. not used with "ar na daoine"--? Did I misunderstand?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SatharnPHL
Mod
  • 1439

Without a direct link to the source, it's impossible to say whether the source was wrong, or you misunderstood, but the NEID entry for "call" explicitly describes glaoch a chur ar as transitive, and has cuir glaoch orm as the translation of "give me a call".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/joanmvanore

Great, thanks. If the other example turns up again (which it's bound to do) I'll check in if I still don't get it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TArdy44

How would you say "I am going to call ON the people" to do something?

Learn Irish in just 5 minutes a day. For free.