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  5. "Rugadh sa Pholainn é."

"Rugadh sa Pholainn é."

Translation:He was born in Poland.

December 18, 2014

17 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/scriptorcailin

Hey! He's Pól-ish!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jillianimal

Once again I think I get the copula and then something like this happens ._. Can't "rugadh se sa pholainn" be accepted too? What is it about this sentence that a copula is used? I thought it was to show that 2 tihngs are one in the same.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/galaxyrocker

The copula isn't used. It's the past autonomous. It's literally like "One birthed him in Poland". It's the colloquial way of saying "He was born in Poland."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jillianimal

Oh thanks, makes sense now. I guess the word order threw me off & I immediately thought it must be copula >_>


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RozieToez

"He" isn't the subject? If it were "Wine was drunk in Poland" wouldn't it be Óladh fíon sa Pholainn? instead of Óladh sa Pholainn fíon? What's different here?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/galaxyrocker

The issue here is translating the saorbhriathar as the passive. It's really not a passive, but more equivalent to the English 'one'. '

But, you're also having the issue of equating English structure with Irish one. Just because something is the subject in English doesn't mean it has to be in Irish - as is this sentence, if you choose to interpret it as a passive. It's the same thing with Tá fíon agam - In Irish, fíon is the subject, but it's "I" in English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RozieToez

Is fíon in my question just the object of the verb then? And the reason é goes after sa Pholainn just because it's a pronoun and as é is not the subject, but the object it can't directly follow the verb?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RozieToez

Ah, got it. GRMA.

I swear the only thing in Irish craftier than those shifty pronouns and their preposition accomplices is that nefarious copula. You know that one's never up to any good.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/galaxyrocker

The object can directly follow the verb, but it's unnatural in natively spoken Irish. Generally, it comes at the end of the clause, if it's an object pronoun.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/galaxyrocker

No, because it's not an object pronoun. Only the pronouns move, as far as I'm aware.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RozieToez

So, in my wine example, could it naturally be said Óladh sa Pholainn fíon?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RozieToez

Yes, but in Óladh fion sa Pholainn are you saying the subject is "one"? A lot more than one drank wine I would assume.

And even if so, how does that explain why the two sentences are structured differently? Was birthed, was drunk, sold, was eaten, was written. Do they function differently?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/galaxyrocker

It's not 'one' as in 'one person only'. It's one' as in an agentless verb. Similar to the English passive, but not quite.

And the structure difference is because é is an object pronoun, which generally comes at the end of the clause (despite some of Duolingo's examples) when used by native speakers.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Gustopher94

Should "rugadh" not be pronounced like "'rʊgu"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Knocksedan

Dialect - Ulster uses the "oo" pronunciation, Munster doesn't (I'm not sure about Connacht).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/galaxyrocker

Connacht generally does (according to An Teanga Bheo: Gaeilge Chonnachta for the first-conjugation verbs.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/khmanuel

I thought that too.

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