"When will he have graduated?"

Translation:När kommer han att ha tagit studenten?

December 29, 2014

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A very awkward Swedish sentence in my opinion. When will anyone ask this? I would rather ask "När ska han ta studenten?"


We'd use this one when speculating about the future. We're discussing this young man's future and when we see his graduating as something that will be completed at a certain point in the future, this is how to say it. Of course we rarely need to use this construction, so your sentence is much more useful, but it doesn't mean the same thing. In English, it would be When will he graduate?, again a very useful sentence, but not the same one we're teaching here.


So I assume that this is sort of a Swedish idiom: ta studenten. Can one give some intuition why take the student would mean to graduate?


To be able to call oneself "student" in Sweden, one formerly needed to pass final exams of late secondary school (Swedish gymnasium). If you passed, you got studentexamen, and hence the expression "ta studenten".

Nowadays, there is no longer a final exam for gymnasiet, but the expression lives on to mean having gone through gymnasiet.


Does it mean that the expression applies only to graduation from the high school? What about graduation from the university?


Yes, from late secondary, comparable to high school. You normally finish it during the year you turn 19.

For graduating from college and university, you'll get a kandidatexamen (Bachelor's degree) for a 3-year education, Masterexamen (Master's degree) for a 5-year education and a PhD is en doktorsexamen.


But what's the verb? Something other than ta studenten?


So does that mean you ask "tagit kandidat" if asking about future graduation from university/colledge.


tagit examen - we specify if needed, e.g. tagit kandidatexamen.


So you are an "elev" until you pass the studentexamen?


No. Students of tertiary education (gymnasium) and above are studenter. Before that, in primary and secondary education, you are an elev.


So in the pastwhat were students called prior to taking and passing the exam? Eleverna?


So it is more like "become a student" instead of "take the student", isn't it? Maybe it's short for "take the student exams" originally?

I also have difficulty understanding "ta examen" meaning graduate. I mean you could take the exams and fail... Only if you pass the exams you graduate. Or does "ta examen" actually mean pass the exams in Swedish?


The meaning of examen has shifted in Swedish from its original "test of knowledge" to the modern "succesful test of knowledge". So it shouldn't be thought of as an exam today, but as of a degree. Hence, it's something you can take.

The expression ta studenten comes from the longer ta studentexamen, using this modern meaning. To do this today, you need to fulfill a set of criteria but it's not dependent on passing a single exam or small number of exams.


Thank you very much! It makes sense now.


Why do you need "att" here but not elsewhere? Why not: När kommer han ha tagit studenten?


It's acceptable to skip att here, many people do especially in speech.


What is about "utexaminera" in this context?


Utexaminera is seen from the perspective not of the student, but the teacher or institution that gives out the degree. So it's usually used in the passive. en utexaminerad ekonom = 'an economist who has received a degree'


Is it acceptable to say "När ska han (att) ha tagit studenten" to mean the same thing?


It's grammatical (without the att), but it will have a meaning closer to "When is he supposed to graduate?"


Thank you! So, to clarify, ska can replace kommer att here, but ska doesn't take att?


ska can replace kommer att here

Yes and no - like I said, it's grammatical but it changes the meaning. They're not interchangeable.

but ska doesn't take att?

Correct. :)


Okay, I tried "ska," but was marked wrong. DUO corrected it to "kommer att." :-(


That's because the meaning is not exactly the same as "kommer att."

If you use "ska" in this sentence, it means "he should graduate;" if you use "kommer att," it means "he will graduate" (more certain).

I hope this helps.


is "när ska han har tagit studenten" not possible at least in the case where there is very little chance of him not graduating?


...ska han ha tagit...


So...."ta studenten" translates to "graduate" (verb)?


That is correct, though please note that it's only for graduating high school.

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