"Sverige har fått en ny regering."

Translation:Sweden has gotten a new government.

January 4, 2015

42 Comments
This discussion is locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FamEvs

Umm, what's wrong with 'Sweden has a new government'?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jorinde_

Good question, I thought the same. In English, you can use 'have' of 'have got' in case of possessions without any difference in meaning, so in this case, both should be considered correct.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Arnauti

You can use them interchangeably to say that they already have it, but only have got can be used to mean what the Swedish sentence here means, namely that they have 'received' or 'gotten' it. (The first one would be Sverige har en ny regering in Swedish.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NickTheEngineer

So is this more like "has received" as in someone else gave it to them?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Arnauti

Yeah, or more exactly it focuses on the change of state into having something one didn't have before. Basically is never used to mean 'get for oneself', that is skaffa (sig). For instance 'get a life' would be skaffa dig ett liv, you can't use for that.
'Get a job' is ambiguous in English but hon skaffade sig ett jobb and hon fick ett jobb mean different things in Swedish.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NickTheEngineer

Got it, tack för förklaringen


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/OriginalAce

Isn't the change of state sufficiently conferred here by the "new"? Gotten sounds really bad to British English speakers!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Arnauti

That would be Sverige har en ny regering.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FamEvs

Ah, I see - misread it! Thanks!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HaroldWonh

"Has got" is appalling English! You must accept "has".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/devalanteriel

It's that pesky American way of forming the perfect tense again. :) The Swedish sentence doesn't say that Sweden has a new government, it says that it has gotten one. And we do accept both "gotten" and "received". Hope that helps!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jean564934

No that doesn't help, Joel. The word got/gotten/ received adds nothing to the sentence that is not conveyed by the word new. The word has alone should be accepted.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/devalanteriel

My point is that Swedish makes a difference between having something and having received something. Usually, English does too, but it's not very idiomatic to differentiate between them here. Accepting the has-only version would be detrimental to the course - yet not doing it would be detrimental to many learners. Like I wrote above, we'll get back to this sentence later, as we build the next tree version. To be honest, I don't think we'll keep it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RyneSanders

Part of it might be the structure of government. America doesn't have a parliamentary system, so maybe that's a reason why we don't use "has got" in this case. I'm not British, but I know they use "has got" a lot more than we do (not just for governments either).

I never liked "gotten". I think it's also an American thing, something else we did to ruin English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HaroldWonh

Yes, thanks - I've just discovered that you accept "has received" here. It's still very odd English, though!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/devalanteriel

How would you prefer to phrase it? Without reconstructing the sentence entirely, I mean.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HaroldWonh

The only natural English is "has" (I've just got donged yet again). Both "has got" and "has received" suggest that the government has arrived from somewhere else - maybe brought by an errant stork?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/devalanteriel

Hah - I think I should very much like to see that stork!

I think the problem is in idiomatics rather than grammatics here. It's not that the sentence is inherently incorrect in English. Rather, it's not the way you'd typically state that a change in government has occurred.

I will mark the sentence for further discussion for now, and we'll revisit it later to see what we want to do about it. Thank you for your input again.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pekarekr

I would say that Sweden has acquired a new government.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Martin628048

"has got" is acceptable English English and should be accepted here


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Nick29629

'has gotten' urgh very inelegant in English (traditional)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NardoTIcarus

„Traditional” LOL


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Miyam19

"Gotten"? Does not sound right at all.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Zzzzz...

For those of you who are interested in politics, although I realise you are but few. The freshly elected government is limping on:

http://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regeringskrisen_i_Sverige_2014


[deactivated user]

    I agree with Harold that "has got" is dreadful and it makes me twitch just having to write it. It would never be used in this context, at least by anybody with the slightest understanding of basic English grammar. While I understand that it is to make a distinction between different Swedish meanings and highlight "fått", it does not mean that it is okay to translate it into clumsy English.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/devalanteriel

    Please also note that I wrote the following:

    "Like I wrote above, we'll get back to this sentence later, as we build the next tree version. To be honest, I don't think we'll keep it."

    That said, I am no longer officially involved with the course, so I do not know what choices the current team will make.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/yuyu2809

    Why are you not involved with the course anymore, if I may ask?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/devalanteriel

    Duolingo rolled out a new contributor's agreement with which I did not really agree at the time, so I stepped down. To be clear, there was no drama - just me and Duo HQ having slightly different opinions. :)

    Since then, however, I've actually returned again - mostly because there is a small number of users trying to force their racist and sexist views into the course, and since the Swedish team currently has no other really active member, I felt that my presence was needed to counteract the "all immigrants are rapist muslims" idiots.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/yuyu2809

    Thank you for sharing :)


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/razvan252

    God I hope you're still active. That crowd is insidious in their ways and they never stop.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jean564934

    The word 'got' is not essential in that sentence but I was marked wrong for omitting it.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GlennaJo

    I originally wrote it 'has got' but it sounded so wrong to me I deleted "got" and got marked wrong. I will learn to include "fått" in that sentence if I ever need to say it, but I will still translate it into English without "got". It just sounds wrong.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jUPV8MMd

    Yes, i agree. You don't 'receive' a new government, you elect one.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/boDjwyEj

    Thank you SO much for having come back, devalanteriel, and sincerely hope your health has improved. You are my hero. Really. That said, in English, countries do not "receive" new governments (Google search for "has received a new government" = 5 hits, whereas "has got a new government" = 198,000, "has gotten a new government" = 21,600). For what it's worth. :-(


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/devalanteriel

    That's true - I didn't realise "received" was the default. I've changed that to "gotten", to avoid the ambiguity with "got".


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DerrickMcClure1

    I understand the difference between what this (English) sentence is intended to mean and what "Sverige har en ny regering" would mean, but both the sentence and some of the comments are misguided. "Gotten" is American exclusively, and not even all Americans would use it: to most speakers of English throughout the world it sounds odd - either archaic or dialectal. There is nothing "appalling" about "Sweden has got a new government": I (Scottish, and a retired academic in the language field) would find it perfectly normal. I gather the difference between "Sverige har en ny regering" and "Sverige har fat en ny regering" is that the first simply states the fact of a regime change and could be said days or weeks after the event, and the second would be said in immediate response to the change taking place - just after the results were announced, maybe. But in English you wouldn't convey those two senses by choosing between "has" or "has got".


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/John271009

    I understand that there is a difference in swedish, but 'has gotten a new government' is a phrase that a native speaker is very unlikely to utter.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/John271009

    I can only offer my comment as a speaker of American English, but 'has gotten' is a very inelegant construction and something unlikely to roll off the tongue of most native speakers.

    I just hate it when you're rolling along heading toward 100% and then get tripped up by something like this!


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HaroldWonh

    Since this section now does have the Swedish sentence "Sverige har en ny regering", can't this old sentence be scrapped, because of the difficulties of translation into English?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ahferroin7

    This one sounds kind of strange to me in English. Use of 'got' or 'received' in the context of government could just as easily imply a violent transition of power as it could the process of a new PM being appointed (even more so if 'received' is used, as that implies that the process involved a foreign state making the decisions).

    Is this an idiomatic way in Swedish of saying that a new PM and ministers have been appointed, or is there perhaps some more common way of saying it?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RiaWilliam1

    Not happy with your answer


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/devalanteriel

    Feel free to be a little more constructive.

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