"The girls and the boys"
Translation:Flickorna och pojkarna
I always get really confused by the -arna nouns. I can't find a rule for a word like pojke in the lesson notes. Any help?
Here are some general rules for forming plurals in Swedish: If it is an en-word and ends in -a, you add -or (example: kvinna to kvinnor). If it is an en-word and has one syllable or ends in an unstressed syllable, you add ar (example: hund to hundar). That group contains basically all of the en-words that don't end in -a. For some words in this group that end in unstressed syllables, you eliminate the vowel (example: fågel to fåglar). This may seem difficult, but you'll find it natural after a while. If it is an en-word and is a loanword from another language, add -er (example: biljett to biljetter). You also add -er for the "umlaut plurals," which add an umlaut in the plural form (example: fot to fötter). If it is an ett-word, it is the same in the plural, unless it ends in a vowel, in which case you add -n (example: äpple to "äpplen). This all may seem intimidating, but it'll be easy to remember after a while. The -na makes it definite (the). So a long answer for your short question: pojke is an en-word that doesn't end in -a, so you add -ar. Then, you add -na* to make it definite (the boys). Hope my lengthy explanation made sense!
I'm Swedish myself and never knew any of this. I haven't thought about the rules behind the grammar, I just kind of... learned it all. The rules are so complicated and there are so many exceptions for everything, it must be such a pain to learn Swedish as a second language. I'm really glad I got to learn it as my native language so that I don't have to perceive it as difficult.
Why do you study Swedish, when you are Swedish?? Grammar rules are essential for not-native people to learn a language!
I'm not entirely sure of what you mean, but did you ask me why I study Swedish on Duolingo when it's my native language? If so, it was simply because I wanted to see how the lessons looked so I knew what others had to do. (I haven't actually spent so much time with it though, I completed a few lessons and then skipped far, far ahead by doing one of those big tests) And yes, grammar rules are indeed essential when learning a new language.
I wish there was an easy way to find this explanation back again when needed but these good tips seem to get lost in between the comments.
Have you seen my sticky post called Useful links… under Swedish Discussions? https://www.duolingo.com/comment/5892805 That document contains a list with links to some of the best explanations in the course. I'll add a link to this one so it'll be more easily findable from now on.
Where can you see the lesson notes in the app?? I am just finding out thanks to you that there are lesson notes at all!
My guess is that you would have to check out the homepage, since they differ from each other..
Unfortunately, the lesson notes are not available in the apps. They're only on desktop. :(
Thanks! Many comments regarding notes and lessons make so much sense now. I had only been using the app so learning by logic and guessing haha.
Been there, done that. :) We all want them to be available everywhere.
Because I got pojkarna wrong I got a correction to "killarna". Very confusing since kille was not introduced to me yet
Yes, Duolingo is terrible at showing you what you should have entered, unfortunately. We accept killarna since it's a fine translation as well, but it's not supposed to be the main translation you're showed when you get things wrong.
Ok ok there is a serious problem here, I typed "Flickorna och pojkenar" and got it wrong because the "e" was supposed to be an "a", so I then typed "Flickorna och pojkanar" because that is what it said was correct, then it said I got it wrong and that "Flickorna och killarna" was correct or whatever the "k" word for boys is. Why did it not say Killarna the first time? Why did it say Pojkanar and then change to Killarna? Anyone know?
Yes it is. You'd probably say Tjejerna och killarna then. (we actually accept tjejerna och pojkarna too, although I don't think anybody would ever say that in real life).
They are technically synonyms, but it's more common to use flicka for a younger girl (approximately single-digit-age) and tjej for an older girl. Although some people use tjej for younger girls as well, especially to make them feel a little more grown up. I'd say flicka and pojke are less common in modern speech than tjej and kille, except when referring to young children. When you tell someone the sex of your newborn baby you'd probably use flicka or pojke. They're practically interchangable though - however, like Arnauti said, the combinations are flicka/pojke and tjej/kille, it sounds really weird if you say "flicka och kille" or "tjej och pojke".
This is all based on my experience as a native speaker.
What am I meant to use "...orna" for in plurals? Is it for feminine objects?
No, it depends on the noun's declension but it has nothing to do with a flicka being feminine.
flicka = girl. Flickor = girls. Flickorna = the girls
An example is "jag såg flickor" = "I saw girls" vs "jag såg flickorna" = "I saw the girls"
So basicallly "or" when you mean in general and "orna" when you're talking about specific ones. :)