What about Breton and Britanny?
Demat everyone :)
I'm on Duo for some months now and as you've all noticed, we can learn Irish, a celtic language, so what about the native language of my country, Breton? (Brezhoneg) Everybody here in Britanny speak French (because France forced us to since they had us invaded), but a lot of us still speak the celtic language in family context, my boyfriend for example ! There is also TV channels, newspapers, books, TV series, which are still in Breton, and even Diwan Schools (bilingual French/Breton) and everything where I'm from is written both in Breton and French, so it's absolutely not a dead language :) Sadly in my family we don't speak it anymore for 2 generations, I just know some words/expressions from my mother and I would be SO glad if we could learn it on Duo ! Don't hesitate to look for informations about Breton, it ressembles Welsh a lot and it's a really beautiful language, and our culture is vivid and very, very different from the French one, more close to the Scottish/Irish/Welsh etc ones than the French actually ! Here is our anthem, the Bro gozh ma zadoù :3 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cT34lBdVgls
Kenavo and Breizh dieub :)
I believe that all the Celtic languages should surely get a place here on Duolingo so that folks of Celtic blood can keep their languages alive.
You need to find some people who are willing to create and moderate a Breton course.
It would also be cool to have Brittany's other language - Gallo; it would be so interesting to be able to learn a little of, and to compare, the multiple regional languages of France, Spain and Italy. Of course, even with the incubator mechanism, it must take a lot of time to add languages and there are so many!
I wonder if they have considered a category of "short tree" languages, with only a dozen skills or so, like "exhibition sports" at the Olympics, as a way to gather a community around small languages on the site before building a full tree. I guess the problem is that the fixed cost of showing people how to use the incubator tools is still the same, whether they are to do a full tree or a short one, however, I imagine they are gradually streamlining and automating that.
Another mystery is how that is to be monetized, I guess there are lots of people who would like to learn Breton but far fewer who speak Breton and want to learn French, which means the immersion won't translate in the useful direction.
I think learning Gallo from English would be difficult, because that would require to speak at least a bit of French to understand. I do speak Gallo and so do my grandparents and my father, but none of us would know how to teach it :/ (my father's family is from the east part of Britanny and my mother's from the west part) but your idea of "mini courses" sounds great, that would be very interesting !
Funny you mentioned the idea of short trees, because Navajo and Hawaiian were just released like that! Foreshadowing in real life!
I would love to see Breton on here. Personally, I'm actually more interested in learning Welsh and Scottish Gaelic (on account of my British heritage) but it's my understanding that Breton has been struggling more than the other Celtic languages (on account of the French government having some absurd idea about linguistic purity in France, as though there are not a huge number of diverse languages native to legally French soil) and I would love for it to get any shot at surviving it can.
I mean, the French government really crapped on Breton. It went from over a million speakers in the 1950s (it was for a very long time the healthiest of the Celtic languages) to only 2-300,000 come the 21st century, a sizable majority of whom were senior citizens, and only ~30,000 of whom actually used the language. There are revival efforts now, but that to me is a terrifying decline of a language and culture that I would love to see turned back as much as possible.
Please apply on the incubator only then is there a vote to make breton a possible.. either English to Breton (open to over 1 billion people) or French to Breton
I'm sure people would love to learn Breton if enough contributors can be gathered and it eventually reaches the Incubator. France is one of the only European countries not to give rights to speakers of minority languages, meaning France's indigenous languages are in a lot of danger.
France had in the past no consideration for our culture and language. For example, when my grandfather (who had Breton as his mothertongue) was in school, there was in the rules "forbidden to speak Breton and to spit out on the floor". It was just lately that France realised the mystake and decided to rehabilitate Breton/Gallo and to promote our culture, but it was too late, Breton had widely disappeared as a mothertongue /: Today we try to revive it the more we can because us in Britanny love our country and our traditions :)
I am a little bit late with my comment sorry... it has been the same for us in Belgium with Walloon - just forbidden... unfortunately, we find it very hard to give life again to our local language without a proper sense of the culture it was carrying :-( - that seems to be easier for the celtic languages, even if it took time to find their way, they did it !
I am going to learn Walloon just because I do not want it to die - but also Breton :-)
Maybe his mother would like to do it, I will ask her the next time I see her ;)
I think Breton would be a lovely addition (: I don't know why but I have such an affinity for celtic languages. We need to make sure that we keep these wonderful languages alive!!
I totally agree with you. I don't know where it is coming from but something tells me to learn every celtic language existing. I'd love to be able to study and hopefully learn Breton on duolingo.
I'd love that. I'm learning Breton at Memrise, but I really miss the audio.
I hope they will add Breton as soon as possible:)
If they want to add Tamazight language, i would like to help, i am an Amazigh and i speak it. The Amazighs are the indigenous people of North Africa, or what we call Tamazgha. with a population exceeding 30 million in what is now Tunisia, Libya, Mauritania, Algeria, Mali, Morocco, Niger, the Canary Islands and Siwa oasis in Egypt.
The Amazighs are also known by the name “Berbers”, which derives from the Roman term for “barbarian”, a name given to anyone who did not speak Latin.
Hey, I just wrote a post on breton, with a presentation of the language + ressource links. Everyone one interested can add links there : https://www.duolingo.com/comment/7542040$comment_id=7549471
Demat! I can't wait myself for a Breton course. Maybe from French, it would be great. I can learn from English, like I do for Welsh now, bit still. I love Welsh, as every other celtic languages, but Breton is more near me. I am not, I am from Québec, Canada, but I have a remote Breton branch in my family tree, and my fiancé's are nearer: his grand father was breton, from Vannes I think. Here in Québec I know there is a little Breton diaspora, I saw a show of breton and gallo music and we even were thought some dances. So this interest me a lot! Also, for the very few words of Breton I know, I can already see it is close to Welsh, with "amser"-"amzer" for exemple. Since I wish to learn loads of different languages, I thought that learning them by families might help me.
So, following this discussion and hoping to see a class someday! :D
This the language I would like to learn the most next. I'm from Wales and our Saints and ancient scholars are the same as most of the Breton and Cornish Saints and ancient scholars. Our ancient folklore and the Breton folklore come from the same roots. My town in Wales has a road sign pointing to Locminé (Breton: Logunec'h) in Morbihan.
Ideally I would like it focussed on one of the dialects, but any route in would be good. A lot of the materials for learning Breton are from French and I would like a version from English (or even from Welsh), but if a French to Breton version was available, then I would work a bit harder on getting my French up to scratch.
In my understanding the Breton and Cornish languages are like Brothers and Sisters, while Welsh would be a first or second cousin - if you can count to twenty in Welsh, then it takes about a minute to learn the slight differences in Cornish and Breton. Irish and the Goedelic celtic languages are more distant relatives, who speak with the same constructions, but have moved that much further apart over time.
Yes, Cornish and Breton are very closely related. The two communities remained connected culturally and economically well after the Bretons were forced to the European continent up until more modern times when English colonization of Cornwall supplanted much of the native Cornish culture and language. Unfortunately, the Cornish language was poorly documented, and when it technically died out, there was not enough records to reconstruct the language in entirety. So they turned to Breton to help fill in the gaps. There are some notable differences between Breton and Cornish--Breton has been influenced by French is ways Cornish never was--but yes, the relation between is very strong.
I studied Breton before I started Welsh and it is has made it easier. I think Welsh is overall an easier language to learn than Breton, but I think knowing a little one will definitely help with the other.
And yes, most resources for Breton are French language resources. There just isn't much interest in Breton outside of France right now.
What about breton on Duolingo so ? Any news ? I don't see that language in the incubator for the moment. Anyone knows more about it ? Thanks
I speak Welsh and have also learnt Irish, Breton and Scottish Gaelic. Duolingo Irish has realy helped and there are nearly 200,000 learning Welsh on Duolngo now too. Chans mad da'r vrezhonegerion. PS I only get a 6 on my welsh flag as i am looking at it as a teacher not a pupil Petroc ap Seisyllt
"chañs vat d'ar vrezhonegerien(/vrezhonegerion)" mod-se e vez lavaret Petroc2. "chañs" zo benel, neuze ez eus ur c'hemmadur dre vlotaat (m->v). Kavet e vez kemmadurioù en holl yezhoù keltiek me 'gav din./// that's how we write petroc2. "chañs" is feminine, so we change the first letter (mad-> vat) as we do in all celtic languages. It's nice of you to wish good luck to breton speakers :)
evel boazh ar geriou 'estren' zo gourel e Kembraek.... Met chans zo benel e kembraek ivez ... siawns dda da=mat dda=vat
Ar frazenn skrivet ganeoc'h a oa e brezhoneg, 'gav din, ne vern penaos e vez lâret e Kembraeg rak ne vez ket cheñchet reizh ar gerioù pa vez tremenet d'ur yezh d'eben... N'eo ket gwall sklaer an afer-mañ, ne ra forzh 'vat !
I'd really like to make this happen once I'm a bit more advanced in Breton (either as a course for English speakers or for French speakers). Any native speakers here like HaruHoshi interested in building a course with me?
From all the celtic languages Brezhoneg is the one i want to learn the most. Please Duolingo add this endangered language, it would mean so much!
Are Brittany and Irish languages close in linguistic terms, like do they share a family?
Irish and Breton are both Celtic languages, but in different branches within that group. Irish is a Goidelic language, like Scottish Gaelic and Manx, and Breton is Brythonic, like Welsh and Cornish.
They are as close as German and French to each other! ie two seperate branches of the celtic languages at least 3000 years apart. Welsh ad Breton are much closer separated 1500 years ago.
Me a vefe prest da sikour treiñ Duolingo e Brezhoneg ;) I would be happy to help translating Duolingo in Breton ;)
I’m all for it, it could complement the Welsh course nicely and help out a moribund language. Question though: how will the rhotics be pronounced? Traditional alveolar or common velar?
Breton and all the Celtic languages will one day be on DuoLingo. We just need people who can create the course.
There are a lot of them actually! It is always a pain for speakers of minority languages in France to have their language included because they are not taken seriously. Since our languages are recognised by no one, webmasters are always very reluctant to add our languages. Take Facebook, for instance: it took such a long time before we could convince them to add Breton, and once this was done, the interface was translated in a record amount of time! Nowadays it is the turn of Duolingo and Twitter to make us wait for ages... There are very competent and motivated people who would be more than happy to contribute to Duolingo. For that, we just need to convince the right person to press the right button ;)
I just contacted the Celtic League about creating teams to develop courses for Breton and other Celtic languages. We'll see what they say.
I am in love with the Celtic languages. Out of the modern six, Breton is the most intriguing. Plus that French twist makes it sound like no other!
Most part of breton speakers are not "twisted". Among those who have learned the language recently there are some, you're right, but it's seen as un uggly way of speaking. Not "sexy" at all ! °°°°°°°°°° Ne c'hallez ket lâret e vez klevet levezon ar galleg 'ba beg an holl. E-touez ar re o deus desket n'eus ket pell zo ya, e c'hall bezañ, hogen divalav da vat eo an doare-se da gomz 'vit ar vrezhonegerien. N'emañ ket pinvidigezh hor yezh 'ba levezon ar galleg...
It doesn't look like your English and Breton are translations of each other. I've been having a bit of fun trying to see if I could guess the translation of your message, but I have no knowledge of Breton and it isn't something Google translate can help me with - we definanetly need a Duolingo course. I've been trying to guess Welsh equivalents for the words:
Lâret - ???
Klevet - Clywed - to hear? Holl - holl - all/everything? Desket - Dysgu - to learn? pell - pell - far/distance
C'hallez? - Cael or Gallu? Ne c'hallez ket - I can't/I don't get???
divalav - difalio - something like ruin or not looking after yourself?
da - da yezh - Iaith
I'm guessing galleg is gaulish or French and vrezhonegerien is Breton/breizhoneig
Since Vikqueen asked about the influence of French - I guess levezon ar galleg, means influence of French?
By the way, the translation of Erwancaer's message would be something like: "You cannot say that the influence of the French language can be heard in everybody's way to speak. Among the people who have learnt it recently maybe, but this way to speak is ugly for Breton speakers. The richness of our language does not originate from the influence of the French language."
That makes sense. In many languages having a strong non-native accent is unappealing. I'm still enamored with this language! Thank you guys for your information.
DiaouligRuz is right ! Thanks a lot and sorry my breton is far better than my english...
Arthfoel : lâret = lavaret/lavarout = to say (infinitive here but "lavaret" is also a past participle). Well done in any case ! Desket e vo buan ar yezh ganit !/You'll learn breton quickly !
Trugarez vras//merci vras/diolch yn fawr i ti a Diaoulig Ruz.
Yes I really would like to learn Breton/Llydaweg. We are celtic cousins and I realise that there are big differences, but so much similarities.
Breton would be a wonderful addition. I think it, and all the other smaller languages of the world, deserve their place on DuoLingo.
I am french, with family living in Bretagne, so I would LOVE to learn Breton !!!
Breton, but also Gallo and Norman are considered to be endangered by the Unesco, Duolingo would be a good way to save them from extinction (it worked for Esperanto, which isn't even a "real language")
I vote for Breton! Either from French or English, but I would love to see it on this website! I wish I could contribute to the making of the course.
Brao tre e vo da lenn a selout ar Brezhoneg war Duolingo. Posibl e vo dre ar Galleg pe ar Saozneg ( yezh brasoc’h Duolingo) hag sur a walc’h ez eus kalz a Gembregerien, Skosed hag Iwerzhoneger dedenet en hor yezh.
I vote for Breton also. It is what brought me to Duolingo. I decided to learn French in the meantime. I plan on visiting Brittany and would like to be familiar with the native language also. Thanks!
It would be interesting to have Breton course in French and English. I began learning it five years ago in an association and it's a nice language. I'm not enought fluent to help, I think but it would be so nice.