"A Itália foi quatro vezes campeã mundial."

Translation:Italy was world champion four times.

August 6, 2013

38 Comments
This discussion is locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JW777

I agree with Shortplanks…the best, most colloquial sounding English translation would not be Italy was world champion four times. It sounds terrible. We (at least in the US) would say that Italy WON the world championship 4 times.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Danmoller

Maybe "Italy has been"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/chulacholula

why can't I say "campeao"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Davu

Because Itália is feminine and campeão is masculine.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LeonardoN.M

O Brasil tem cinco!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/gringoton

"...a seleção brasileira, vencendo todas as partidas do mundial de 2002 e mantendo sua hegemonia: em 1970, o Brasil se tornara a primeira seleção tricampeã mundial, em 1994 se tornara a primeira tetracampeã, e em 2002, a primeira pentacampeã." https://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sele%C3%A7%C3%A3o_Brasileira_de_Futebol


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shortplanks2009

Italy was world champion four times - this is not what we would say in English, We would be more likely to say Italy were world champions four times. Although Italy, the country, is singular, we treat it as a plural because a country is made up of more than one thing.


[deactivated user]

    Italy - a nation state - is singular. Italy was world champion four times. Even the United States is treated as singular.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Raymond704692

    Italy - in this context - is a football team. In the UK we treat this issue with a certain cognitive dissonance accepting both plural and singular constructions.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kwasi1507

    It can be plural too.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/cloudhorizon

    Since it's talking about Italy, the country (a unified entity/nation) that won the championship, I have to disagree with you and say that "were" looks unnatural to me. I found an article about it, if you'd like to take a peek. http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/learningenglish/radio/specials/1535_questionanswer/page51.shtml


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Davu

    I'm assuming this sentence is talking about Italy the football team because the statistics are correct. You can either think that the Italian team play as a single unit, or they are playing as a group of individual players. In the UK, our newspapers have whole sections devoted to football and I'm fairly sure they would all choose "Italy were champions" over "Italy was champion" even if that sounds strange to American ears.

    [Added later] See this article on some of the differences between US and UK usage: http://tinyurl.com/oeombhe


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/cloudhorizon

    I guess it's a matter of perspective, that might even be influenced from where you come from (Like you said). To me, since these teams represent the country, to bring glory to the name and everything in a world championship, the country and the team can't be separated!


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Davu

    Here is a typical UK newspaper report about a football match:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/spain/10128746/Spain-win-Under-21-European-Championship-as-Thiago-Alcantara-inspires-them-to-glory-against-Italy.html

    You can already see from the URL the use of the plural. If you read further on you'll see this fragment: "... Italy were quickly level through a fine Ciro Immobile goal". There are several other examples as well.

    Curious how English usage varies so much throughout the world. I guess on Duolingo we should use US English or lose hearts.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shortplanks2009

    Which is what I said in the first place ;P :)


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MRMsys

    No, you should not lose hearts (or heart), but rather report any instance in which standard English is not accepted. The goal of this section is to learn Brazilian Portuguese, remember.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ShirleyMoo9

    No Davu, for once I must disagree with you, the correct English usage should always be from European English, we were the first, and will always be the best ;)


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Davu

    Just a quick reply to MRMsys. I understand your point, but there is no such thing as "standard English" in this case and US and UK English usage differs.

    On the face of it accepting both styles should work but I'm not so sure it is that easy. Which variant should be chosen when this question is set in the reverse direction? If you were happy to answer "Italy were ..." here, you would probably be upset to have to translate from "Italy was ..." later on. The way Duolingo have resolved this problem is to settle on US usage (unsurprisingly). There are very few examples of this type of problem and they really don't interfere much with the goal of learning Brazilian Portuguese.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/xoxua

    Both could be right, depending on context.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/gringoton

    cloudhorizon's link is talking about a country, 'The United States', and misses the point Shortplanks2009 has made, which is how people actually talk about sport in his country (which I assume is England).

    In this particular sentence we are not talking about a single country rather a team made up of individual players. See also: Family, company, and similar 'group nouns'.

    Oxford Practice Grammar (Intermediate) by John Eastwood, Appendix 5: American English, section K, page 379, offers this comparison:

    "In Britain a group noun can usually take either a singular or a plural verb. The crowd was/were getting restless. Sweden plays/play Germany tomorrow.

    In the US a group noun takes a singular verb. The crowd was getting restless. Sweden plays Germany tomorrow."

    However, even American English can go both ways depending on whether you are using a team's place name (e.g. Chicago) or their mascot name (e.g. the Bears, notice the 's' ending).

    Deixa pra lá. Vamos aprender o português.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/gringoton

    I got it wrong too. It's definitely a UK/US English thing. I'm from the US, but I have taught from Oxford, Cambridge, and Pearson Longman textbooks for about 10 years now, and I cannot go back. Wouldn't get too hung up on it though. Focus on the the goal: A língua portuguesa!


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/reno300

    I agree that 'were' and 'champions' should be accepted and I reported that.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NormanEdwa

    You would, you are a bloody Arsenal fan.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mewzyk

    Qual é a diferença com as duas palavras: "campeão" e "campeã"?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Paulenrique

    "campeão" is used for masculine, singular nouns, and "campeã" is used for feminine, singular nouns.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/gringoton

    'Were' would also be accepted if The Queen had her say here.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/4oYBIxtO

    For Brazil, "O Brasil passou a ser bicampeão mundial" was used. What is the difference? Could we use campeão also for Italy?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Paulenrique

    Italy is a feminine country, that's why "campeã" was used.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Annarulv

    Italia was four times world champion -????


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AndersonGlas

    We also say Italy was a four time world champion.


    [deactivated user]

      "23/10/14 Ulster 13 Toulon 23, European Champions Cup match report: Two-time defending champions take big step towards the knockout stages."

      So, at least in BrE, Italy is the four-time world championship.

      ("four-time" is used as an adjective, so it is not pluralized.)


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/gessa12

      Hi emeyr, i suspect it's just a typo but ...Italy are the four-time world CHAMPIONS


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KaylaAdams437169

      I just had a translation that said two-time world champs..... Why am I getting it wrong if I flip either sentence in the "wrong way"?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/WesJM-O

      Two-time or four-time?

      Can you elaborate I didn't understand the question?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kwasi1507

      Italy have been world champion four times... o.o


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnaLydiate

      My answer is EXACTLY the same as the "correct" but deemed wrong?! - anyone else having this problem????

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