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  5. "Siamo noi le vittime qui."

"Siamo noi le vittime qui."

Translation:We are the victims here.

August 9, 2013

45 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Storybookmum

Is it "siamo noi" for emphasis that it is WE who are the victims?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tspence92

I would say so. Think of it like.... "It is US that are the victims here" instead of "We are the victims here"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Giovanni666

I would have thought so too however my "It is we that are the victims here" was marked incorrect.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KT84222

It could be because we use 'who' to refer to people : it is we who are the victims here.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dieswaytoofast

Then why not "we are ourselves the victim here"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Germanlehrerlsu

dieswaytoofast: (cool id): I think there's a difference between "It's WE who are the victims here, ( & no one else)" vs. "we are ourselves the victim here (in addition to others who feel or are said to be victims). That's at least the way I read the two.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Germanlehrerlsu

Tspence92: To be grammatically correct, it should read: "It is we..." 'Us" is an object pronoun and though commonly used as you say, it's still technically incorrect. Of course we say all the time, "It's me, it's him, it's her, etc." but if you turn it around and start with the predicate NOMINATIVE, you'd clearly see the error: "Me it is, him it is, her it is, etc." Colloquial English is odd for that reason. Say it one way it's "Us", say it another it's "We". Other languages such as German, e.g., maintain the nominative subject case, regardless of work order.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GastonDorren

Correct is what people say. The 'nominative argument' just doesn't cut ice. Latin and German do it that way, many other languages (Arabic and Polish for instance, though I can't remember the details) do it differently. And in German you can't even say 'That's I' or 'that's me' - it has to be 'that am I' (das bin ich). Different logic altogether. Yes, colloquial English is weird, but that's because all languages, colloquial or otherwise, seem weird to those who don't speak them.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/redbrickhouse

"Correct is what people say."

Suppose this is true. All language and grammar lessons are consequently unnecessary. Whatever you are saying is correct. You have nothing to learn. Or if you do have anything to learn, it would not be in a classroom, but on the street instead. Because whatever anybody else is saying is correct as well. Why are we wasting our time here, asking about whether this or that expression is right? If you heard someone say it, it's correct! How wonderful is that!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Germanlehrerlsu

redbrickhouse: You're exaggerating and overstating what I and other users have said. It's not that grammars are unnecessary and should be discarded in favor of whatever is said out there on the street. The point I tried to make is that when what a majority of native speakers say over time becomes so ingrained in the language that it's accepted as natural by that majority, then grammars should reflect that acceptance. Blind adherence to and insistence upon outdated norms will in the end only impede this natural development of a living language such as English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jeffrey855877

The "correct" grammar ("it is we") to my ear sounds weird. I think there's a very good reason for this: Most of the time, we is the subject of a sentence which is invariably followed by a verb. When I hear "we", I expect to hear words continuing the sentence - "it is we who do the grunt work of correcting grammatical errors."

"Us" is often found at the end of phrases or sentences. I don't expect to hear some sort of continuation. As the object of a sentence, it completes the thought.

So, using the phrase, "It is us" permits my ear to hear a completed thought, an entire sentence. If it's "It is we", I expect more words, the sentence seems incomplete, even though technically it's not.

This feeling is made stronger if "It's" is used instead of "It is": the sentence "It's we" sounds really, really awkward, while "It's us" sounds just fine. Technically, "It's we" is the grammatically correct choice - but you won't find me saying it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/redbrickhouse

Why are people upvoting "it is US"? Maybe you should all take the English course first. Or is that what is taught there?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Germanlehrerlsu

redbrickhouse: Because that's what's said. That doesn't make it more correct or "It is we" wrong, but living languages change with time and usage and progressive grammars reflect that change. Most speakers say e.g. "It's him" not "It's he" etc. Languages grow and adapt, its users should too. Norwegian e.g. says "Det er meg" (objective case) -- i.e., "It's me" -- while Italian says "Questo sono io." (subject case). Bottom line: Non è meglio, non è peggio, è diverso.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/redbrickhouse

"Because that's what's said." I don't really believe this is your standard for good English. It is no standard at all.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HelenHalva

i totally agree. It is we, it is he, it is I. Maybe rewording the sentence would help the more "modernist" grammarians here---We are the ones who . . I am the one who . . . etc. But IT IS US is wrong.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Trichopteran

I am also confused about this...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/seanwtreacy

Me too. Would love to hear an explanation!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GastonDorren

The explanation further up is perfectly correct: 'siamo noi' is the same as English 'WE are' (and not the others).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/darkpeak

whoever compiled this section was in a very strange place, mentally!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MichaelGia9

Does this mean "here" both "in this physical place" and "in this situation"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/silen03

In Italian "qui" can mean both.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DaveVelo1

Wouldn't "we ourselves are victims here" be a more accurate translation?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jeffrey855877

I think so. (except it's "the victims"). That's a good way of adding emphasis in English, and it reflects the intent of the Italian construction, as "noi" is clearly present for emphasis sake.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ckyle8

Here's a word it's good to know, even if you hope never to have to use it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sp4mblob

make sure you get it right when you use it. "facciamo le vittime qui" would mean something completely different ;-)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/colbymenning

Would imperative be only "siamo" with the exclamation ! ? And this would emphasize also ? And Noi would then precede verb "siamo" if used? Here, ordinary sentence so "noi" follows verb for emphasis.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GastonDorren

An imperative would not have 'noi', just 'siamo', I'd think.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Odium1002

I said we are the sacrificial lambs here. Maybe too liberal?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Germanlehrerlsu

Perhaps a bit too poetic - better for something written in Iambs.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LilyParish1

I love how you got downvoted for this


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/hagemeijerhans

"siamo noi" = in english : are we ? Is it at the same time a question ??


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jeffrey855877

No. This is not a question. The "noi" is there for emphasis, so a better translation is "we ourselves".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mitch_milanese

”Noi siamo le vittime qui” why "Noi" and "Siamo" are upside down? Please give me your advice, it would be most appreciated.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Germanlehrerlsu

Noi siamo...in my opinion is unstressed, unemphatic. It's simply a neutral statement. Placing noi after the verb emphasizes in my mind that it's Us who are the victims. WE are the victims, rather than anyone else.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Maxrivers2

I put, here we are the victims


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/roxannagiovanna

"here we are the victims">>>>IS TOTALLY CORRECT in the english language, in French, in Spanish.....! If fact my translation is USED MORE frecuently!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Lombob

So far in this lesson I have seen "la vittima" and "le vittime". Does "vittimo" and "vittimi" exist in Italian language , or can only females be a victim nowadays?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/silen03

"Vittima" - pl. "vittime" - is a feminine noun, that doesn't mean the person is a woman.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/solvei17

Noi siamo = we are Siamo noi = are we


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/schillic

What's wrong with: "we are here the victims"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Germanlehrerlsu

The word order sounds unnatural.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Caterinabella

We are - us - the victims here.

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