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"Yo quisiera que tú fueras a la universidad."

Translation:I would like you to go to college.

1
5 years ago

189 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/NobleJohn
NobleJohn
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Both Quisiera and Fueras are PAST subjunctive, so should this be "I would like you to have gone to university"? The translation given seems to be present tense?

90
Reply34 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Elizabeth0

A friend of mine explained this kind of thing to me not that long ago. He gave me the sentence "Juan Diego me dijo que yo FUERA a Chihuahua." (English translation: "Juan Diego told me to go to Chihuahua") and said the reason the past subjunctive is used for the "to go" is because the first clause is past tense, but in English, we don't really have to have that kind of arrangement so "to go" is good.

EDIT: I found a page on another site that explains this futher. (http://spanish.about.com/od/verbmoods/a/subjunctive_tenses.htm)

  • "If the main verb is in the preterite, imperfect [which quisiera is], past perfect or conditional tense, and the dependent (subjunctive) verb [fueras] refers to action that takes place (whether in actuality or not) at the same time or after the action of the main verb, then the imperfect subjunctive is used. Example: Esperé que comieras. (I expected you to eat.)"

So if we translate the first part to be "I would (currently) like", which is perfectly legit, then the fueras can mean 'to go' either immediately or at a later time. "I would like you to go to college." And that encompasses both the present, "I would like you to go to college...now.", and a future time, "I would like you to go to college...next year."

172
Reply394 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/generalmola

Quisiera is not the imperfect. It is the past subjunctive. That is what is odd about the sentence. In this formulation, the "quisiera" needs to indicate uncertainty in the past, such as "perhaps I wanted...", although adding "quizas" would clarify. I know that some commenters say that quisiera is meant to convey politeness, but in virtually every conversation I have partaken, the conditional (querria) is used to convey politeness. I am having a difficult time understanding how this sentence is correct, that is, how the verb in the main clause is past subjunctive.

9
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Elizabeth0

Quisiera is imperfect as well as subjunctive. So I thought that when the site mentioned imperfect, that included in both the indicative and subjunctive moods (because it doesn't specify either).

imperfect

Maybe it's cultural, where different places use querría more often and others use quisiera.

9
Reply13 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/DavidMoore622957

Without thinking about it too much, I assumed the subjunctive was triggered by the speaker expressing a wish/desire. But I get your point. That wouldn't really make too much sense for the past tense. In other words, a simple wish would be something closer to, "I want you to go to college."

Instead, I think the idea is that you is (probably?) not going to college and the speaker is expressing their wish against that perception.

1
Reply9 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/elizadeux
elizadeux
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Quisiera is imperfect subjunctive.

1
Reply3 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/homefire

I put "I would like it if you would go to the university," which means exactly the same thing, but it was marked wrong.

3
Reply13 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/nastyaho
nastyaho
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It is gramatically wrong in english

0
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tejano
tejano
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Good job, homefire, in finding that link. I found it as well, and some others that confirm it. Like you, I have never heard of such a rule in spite of it four years of high school, five at the university and countless references to grammar references over the years to ensure my business correspondence had (at least) no glaring errors. Without digging out those dusty grammars, I hesitate to say this "rule" isn't imposed in the US, but it does seem that most sources alluding to it are from the UK, Belgium and the like. Or, perhaps, they are ESL sites. "Never' is a very big word, though, and to the extent the rule governs anywhere in the English-speaking world, it does not, as your link shows, apply in the case of "polite conditionals."

Also this: http://blog.harwardcommunications.com/2010/10/18/polite-conditionals-would-in-the-if-clause/ which states:

Polite conditionals – “would” in the if-clause The rule that states “never use will or would in the if-clause of conditional sentences” is not 100% true. We do use “would” in the if-clause in polite conditionals.

For example:

  • I would be grateful if you would send me an answer as soon as possible, and in any event, not later than COB on Thursday.
  • We would appreciate it if you would arrange for immediate payment.

Also: http://www.usingenglish.com/glossary/other-conditionals.html

4
Reply23 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tejano
tejano
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Someone else thinks so as well. But I don't think so. Or could you cite the specific grammatical rule that's violated there?

Were you to turn the clauses around so as to say "If you would go to the university, I would like it," would that be grammatically wrong in English?

0
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/homefire

Interesting! That is a rule that I have never heard before. Maybe a rather obscure one, since it never came up in my high school English classes?

I searched for info on this since I'd never heard of it, but really didn't find anything saying it was wrong. This page discusses it at the bottom, but it sounds like this sentence fits the exception??

http://grammar.ccc.commnet.edu/grammar/conditional2.htm

In any case, grammatically correct or not, the answer I gave would be very common usage in the U.S.

3
3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Metlieb
Metlieb
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I can't directly reply to you, so let me do this this way. I remember this rule form my high-school times very well. Our teachers put much effort for us to remember and stick to this rule. But different schools and different habits, eh? However, your sentence still doesn't fit into the exception. The exception describes cases where the will or would are modal verbs and not conditional clauses. Modal verbs further define the verb: I must go to school, I want to go to school, I would like to go to school. Do you see how the latter looks like an if clause? This fits into the mentioned exception. But on the other hand, languages tend to be very inconsequent at times and American English has some of these inconsequences, sadly. For example: "How are you doing? - I'm doing good". This sentence just ignores the difference between adjective and adverb. Superman does good. You're doing well.

3
3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/RositaLW

In Australian English it is "uneducated' to say "I am doing good" instead of "I am doing well". That is American slang.

0
2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Linda_from_NJ

Conditional subjunctive future: If I would be bilingual, I must study every day.

0
2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Metlieb
Metlieb
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The rule is to never use a would in an if-clause. So neither your first nor your second variant of the sentence is correct. It should either be I would like it if you went to university or If you went to university, I'd like it.

-2
3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Linda_from_NJ

If you are writing about homefire's translation, it most emphatically is NOT grammatically wrong in English. I myself translate "I would like that" (the literal Spanish) to "I would like it if." In this English construction, the word "it" is a placeholder. I am not marked wrong either.

0
Reply2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Paulalock

For some reason I can't reply to your other post but "If I would be bilingual, I must study every day" doesn't sound right to me - need to investigate what you call conditional subjunctive future... more grammar ;)

0
2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Linda_from_NJ

Paulalock, I put the sentence together just to see if there could actually be a sentence that would use the conditional verb "would" in the subjunctive, and yes, the sentence "If I would be bilingual, I must study every day" is odd sounding. Also, since I hastily coined the phrase "conditional subjunctive future" to describe the sentence's elements, it could be missing some descriptors. (IMO, some of the names of the more sophisticated grammatical terms overlap because of the nature of complex syntax. I am more concerned with whether the syntax itself is sound and defensible than with whether I recalled the grammatical construction's penultimate name.)

Before putting the sentence out there for discussion, I did a little digging so that I could justify the unusual syntax and grammar. There are several limitations if you want to use the word "would." Here's what I found:

1) In English, three types of verbs are used for subjunctive mood, and they are "were" (If I were your mother), "be" (You asked that he be quiet), and third person singular verbs used with first, second and third person nouns/pronouns, regardless of whether they are singular or plural (The teacher requested that they try harder). Accordingly, I concluded there were two conditions to be met in order to put "would" into subjunctive mood. The first was that the "unreal" conditional aspect would be indicated by an "if were " construction. The second was that the word "would" must appear in that "if were " construction so that there was no doubt about whether the word "would" was being used in a subjunctive sense. "Would" is a modal verb that can used to change the aspect of "be," so putting them together was logical. Because the word "be" can be used subjunctively, all that happened was that the aspect of "be" was changed so that the first part of the sentence was not only subjunctive but also conditional.

This had the effect of tweaking the sentence's meaning so that its first part describes a potential future outcome (If I would be bilingual) and its second part describes a timeless condition to be met in order to achieve that potential outcome (I must study every day).

2) That took care of the "If I would be bilingual" part of the sentence, but the next thing was to figure out what tense would work in the "then" part of the sentence. The syntactic issue was how to indicate a time beyond the future. "Must" is a "defective" verb that has no tense changes in English. By using this modal verb, I sidestepped the inescapable fact that events proceed from past to present to future. BTW, I probably should have used "I must study hard" in the second part of the sentence so that the lack of tense of the verb "must" was indisputable.

3) Finally, since this sentence combines elements of subjunctive mood and conditional mood with modal verbs, I just wanted to add that the word "would" is a combination of "will" + "could" and in that respect changes timelines in the sense that the meaning goes from "willing something to happen now" to "possibly making something happen later through the force of one's will."

Here are the websites I used to come to these conclusions: http://grammar.ccc.commnet.edu/grammar/conditional2.htm https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/defective_verb http://www.englishpage.com/minitutorials/subjunctive.html http://english.stackexchange.com/questions/145854/past-subjunctive-vs-present-subjunctive

0
1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/yaz150317
yaz150317
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Me too x 3

0
Reply4 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/RobCrownsSuck

, if you went to Uni. -- is real English, no idea if it's DuoLingoly correct

0
Reply4 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/s_helmer

Thanks for the reminder.

1
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/josh.ramirez500
josh.ramirez500
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thanks

0
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/phosporousman7

Great explanation...thanks!

0
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/joehhendrickson

But why do we translate the first part present tense if it is past? And why is it wrong if you don't?

0
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
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The translation above is "I would like you to go to college.", but "I would like you to go to the university." is also accepted. Perhaps they had a different sentence listed above when you asked this? http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/would

0
Reply2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/CorianderNutmeg

It accepted "I would like it if you went to college." I prefer that English translation to the indicated answer, "I would like you to go to college," because even though it is not a one-to-one translation (e.g., "que" is not typically used for "if"), it captures the fact that even in English we sometimes use past tenses (here, "went") in relation to stuff that may or may not happen in the future.

36
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/cromwellt

Actually, the "went" is an example of subjunctive use in English, not past.

3
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/supercalidocious

Like "If I were you. . ."

2
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/RobCrownsSuck

Someone with grammar!

0
Reply4 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/IshtarmuzI

I would think, "I wish that you were going to college." would be more correct

9
Reply14 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tejano
tejano
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This is what I suggested months ago. After all, one perfectly legitimate rendering of the imperfect subjunctive fueras would be 'were going' and it complies with the condition noted by Elizabeth0 above: "[fueras] refers to action that takes place (whether in actuality or not) at the same time or after the action of the main verb.

For example: "I wish you were going now" or "I wish you were going this coming semester.

No takers, though, nor even musings as to why not..

10
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/IshtarmuzI

maybe it requires a few more rounds

1
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Elizabeth0

I think the problem is with "I wish". I wish = deseo, and I'm not sure if that is a valid translation for quisiera.

0
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Elizabeth0

Gracias, no lo había sabido.

0
4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/elizadeux
elizadeux
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Quisiera can indeed mean I wish, but Duolingo doesn't seem to like it for some reason.

Yo quisiera que estuvieras aquí = I wish that you were here.

0
Reply3 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/RobCrownsSuck

I think they screwed up the English. "I would like it if you went to Uni" sounds like proper English, though subjunctive is neglected by many dialects

0
Reply4 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/elizadeux
elizadeux
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I think that "to have gone" would require the use of the past perfect subjunctive. The past perfect subjunctive suggests that going to college is no longer possible for you anymore.

"I would have liked you to have gone to university" or "I wish you had gone to college= Me hubiera gustado que hubieras ido a la universidad

If going to college is still a possibility (no matter how unlikely), imperfect subjunctive is used. Quisiera in imperfect subjunctive means I wish (Practice Makes Perfect Verb Tenses)

"Yo quisiera tener un millón de dólares = I wish that I had a million dollars."

In both the English and the Spanish, you still wish that you a million dollars. It doesn't mean that you wish you had a million dollars in the past, but you don't wish it anymore.

0
Reply3 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/The_Numinous
The_Numinous
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Not sure where you're getting those haves from. This isn't perfect tense; the verb haber is not used.

-8
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/rogduo
rogduo
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Actually, Numinous´s response is not quite right. You can´t always translate so literally. There are numerous cases where English uses the present perfect, where Spanish might use the present, and others where English uses a perfect past tense, and Spanish a simple past tense. I have lived here 20 years. Vivo aquí hace 20 años. This happens in the subjunctive in many cases as well,and with many modals. Yo no debía decir nada. I should not have said anything. So, in general, we can not say, that just because Spanish does not invoke haber, that English should not invoke have. It is not true.

16
Reply14 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/NobleJohn
NobleJohn
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That doesn't answer my question though. "To go" is present tense, fueras is past tense. How would you phrase the correct answer using the past tense, or maybe you can explain why "to go" is correct in this sentence?

6
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/pvnrt
pvnrt
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The subjuntivo in the past form mainly means that the person which the sentence que introduces is different than the subject of the main sentence AND that what the subject suggests the other person does, is highly unlikely that they would do it. To go is not present tense, it is infinitive therefore it can be used as a loose translation but it fails to demonstrate the low possibility of it happening. "I would like it if you went to college" gets a bit closer but it still is not the same.

1
Reply14 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
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"to go" has no tense at all as it is the infinitive, which is why it can be used here. In Spanish they have many subjunctive tenses, but we do not have as many subjunctive tenses in English. We actually prefer to use the infinitive. http://conjugator.reverso.net/conjugation-spanish-verb-querer.html http://conjugator.reverso.net/conjugation-spanish-verb-ir.html See the lack of correspondence from English to Spanish which means that in English we will use modal verbs and infinitives instead. http://conjugator.reverso.net/conjugation-english-verb-want.html http://conjugator.reverso.net/conjugation-english-verb-like.html http://conjugator.reverso.net/conjugation-english-verb-go.html http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/would

Here you will see the present subjunctive used, negative continuous and passive forms, but what to do for the past? http://www.englishpage.com/minitutorials/subjunctive.html Then I realize: How can something truly be in the past if it has not happened? A possibility that something happen is conditional. A wish that something happen is subjunctive - and you may have wished in the past, present or future, but what you are wishing for may or may not happen - timeless, rather like the infinitive, don't you think?

Of course, the Spanish think of this very differently.

1
Reply2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/philosotox

I'd like it if you went to college is accepted. 'went' is past tense, and even though it's obviously about the future in that English sentence. Subjunctive is odd.

0
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Linda_from_NJ

It is my understanding that "ser" and "ir" are interchangeable in the preterite. Anyone know definitively why not?

0
Reply2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Blas_de_Lezo00
Blas_de_Lezo00
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Do you mean the form "fuera o fuese"? They have the same forms, but the meaning is different. They are not interchangeable, but they have the same forms in all persons.

0
Reply3 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/linearbbq

So... quisiera is a past subjunctive, but it's being used here to form a polite request?

11
Reply5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/rspreng

Yep. Quisiera is the most polite way to say "I would like." A bit more polite than Me gustaria and more polite than quiero

33
Reply25 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/showerduo

Isn't that more like the future I "would like". I'm not disputing what you say just trying to understand. I could just memorize it, but it's better if I understand

0
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/joehhendrickson

I do not think of it a future so much as conditional. E.g., consider the sentence: " If you were any taller, you would be able to touch the ceiling." This is not future tense expressing what will happen when conditions change; it is subjunctive mood indicating what would be true right now under different conditions.

2
Reply13 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Linda_from_NJ

Yes, but colloquially the "want" meaning is common.

0
Reply2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/arturohiero

You could also say "yo queria". Quisiera sounds a bit afectacious

-3
Reply5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/nathanielorion

"queria" would be "I wanted" "querria" (the conditional form) would be correct, but it is almost never used, "quisiera" takes its place :)

16
Reply15 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Joseph2
Joseph2
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Shouldn't this be something more like: "I would have liked that you went to college"?

10
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/rogduo
rogduo
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Or, I would have liked for you to have gone to college, if we wanted to go out of our way to preserve both clauses in subjunctive English (which is a decreasingly common practice).

10
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Joseph2
Joseph2
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I passed the AP Spanish exam, years ago, after taking Spanish for 5 years in high school and middle school. I've gotten so rusty at it, but Duo has been great at helping me re-learn it. One thing I have very clear memories of is that this mood/tense was pretty much learned right at the end of my fifth year and only because we'd probably need to know it for the AP test. It was by far the hardest of all the verb forms, and I wasn't sure that I was still remembering it correctly.

Most literally, I believe it would be translated as something like: "I wanted that you went to college" or "I expected that you went to college." But "wanted that" is VERY awkward in English and "expected that you went" doesn't necessarily convey the subjunctive mood. It just sounds like a fact in English ("I expected that you went, so you did").

So we end up inserting all kinds of helping verbs like, "I expected that you WOULD HAVE GONE..." or "I WOULD HAVE WANTED for you to go..." to make sure it's clearly understood that the wish/hope/desire was unfulfilled. The problem with this is that it makes the verbs seem to be in the conditional tense when they're really not.

A similar thing can occur when translating the imperfect past: for example, "miraba" could be translated as "I saw", "I used to see", "I was seeing", or even "I would see", in the sense of e.g., "I would see my grandparents every Sunday when I was a child." It's not conditional tense even though it might look like it.

22
Reply14 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/rogduo
rogduo
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I largely agree. How the rest of best translated, it would seem to me, is chiefly predicated on whether one assumes quisiera to be subjunctive literally in the past (back then, I wanted you to go..) or is merely the polite form of saying ¨I would like¨ (now) that you would have done some thing (in the past).

Tricky, and I think subject to that first interpretation of quisiera

4
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Joseph2
Joseph2
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I see what you're saying. At this point, I don't even remember which sense of meaning I had in mind when I made my original post. Maybe an easier way to differentiate between the two forms you bring up would be: "I wish you would have gone to college" vs "I wished you would have gone to college".

Re-reading my first post now, it seems obvious that I originally meant something more like the first. But these past few days I've been thinking of it as the second. Very tricky indeed.

0
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/contratiempo

If I am sitting in a restaurant, thirsty for a beer, I would probably say to the waiter "Quisiera una cerveza." But in the vein of this discussion, would I say "Quisiera que me traiga una cerveza," or "Quisiera que me trajera una cerveza?" The first one sounds right to me, but maybe it should be the second?

1
4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/anamalena
anamalena
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You're definitely right... But I put ''I wanted you to go to the university'' and got it wrong.

0
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
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"wanted" is the indicative past and not subjunctive. We just don't have past subjunctive, instead we use the modal verb "would". Also , "quisiera" like "would" is not necessarily referring to the past. http://dictionary.reverso.net/spanish-english/quisiera/forced http://www.englishpage.com/minitutorials/subjunctive.html

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/would

I mean you could use the present subjunctive and say "I want that you go to the university." , but we do kind of notice that the tense doesn't match so we use timeless versions "I would like you to go to the university."

0
Reply2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/rogduo
rogduo
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Yes. Best answer here yet. Sometimes, one has to translate somewhat idiomatically, and not so directly. And tense and perfect vs imperfect can not always be preserved. Good answer!

3
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/cydudge

I was just helping my friend do this. Apart from Spanish being my first language, I have plenty of experience teaching it to English speakers. NONE of the "correct answers" duolingo offers to this sentence are actually correct. The correct answer is rather marked as wrong. "I wish you would go to college" is the right translation

7
Reply14 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/kennynica

Ha ha Ha I live in Nicaragua and my friends almost NEVER correct me when I mess up with the subjunctive mood. Here's a Lingot for giving me a healthier outlook.

0
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
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That should be accepted. Did you report it? Of course, in English we often use the infinitive instead of the subjunctive, but they are both correct, as well as "I would like that you go to college."

0
Reply2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/junevilleco

Why is fueras being used if it is present tense? Wouldn't you use present subjunctive for the second verb (vaya), Yo quisiera que tu vaya a la Universidad (sorry, no accents)

5
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Rickydito

junevilleco: If the primary clause is in the past, you must use past subjunctive in the secondary clause. After "quisiera" (past subjunctive of "querer") you must use past subjunctive in the second clause; therefore "vaya" would not work -- that is present subjunctive.

6
Reply14 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Rickydito

junvilleco: Just a further point: Just because you use past subjunctive in the second clause, does not mean that it necessarily would be translated in the past in English (like this current sentence).

2
Reply14 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/junevilleco

I am still confused. It the translation is "I would like for you...." how is that past subjunctive? The entire sentence is in the present, why isn't it all present subjunctive?

0
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Rickydito

june: First of all, eliminate the word "for" from your English translation. There is nothing in the Spanish that would indicate "for". .......It is a rule: If the primary clause is in any past tense and uses a word that calls for subjunctive, then the secondary clause must be past subjunctive. .......so......If we use "Quisiera" (past subjunctive) in the primary clause, we must also then use past subjunctive ("fueras") in the secondary clause..................so...........technically, the translation would be "I wanted that you went to the university", but that doesn't sound right, so we say: "I would like you to go to the university (or to college)".

4
Reply14 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/junevilleco

OK, thanks; I understand the importance of agreement with dependent and independent clause.

0
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tejano
tejano
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Okay, I'm going to submit that the translation of this sentence should be, with fueras is in its ir form:

  • I [would like / wish] (that) you were going to the university.

(Rendering the preposition "a" as needed by the English collocation: we say "at the university" or "going to" the university.)

4
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/junevilleco

that makes more sense to me. Thanks.

1
Reply24 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Metlieb
Metlieb
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Go to college and go to the university. Why not *go to university"?!

4
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/DonForbes
DonForbesPlus
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I raised this, and "go to university" is now accepted.

0
Reply2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tylerlucas13

Isn't "quisiera" from the verb "querer," meaning "want"? Why isn't "wanted" or "would want" accepted?

3
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SariahLily
SariahLily
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Because in English we don't really have a past subjunctive form for "want". The closest is "I would like".

Translating subjunctives into English is always a bit tricky.

1
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Paulalock

My Spanish teacher likes us to use quisiera as it is polite and educated but if I use it when I'm with Spanish friends they think it's "cursi"!

3
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/gernt
gernt
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At last, some Spanish I can really use. Gringos immersed in Spanish are cursi. We feel like we're walking on thin ice.

2
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/GregHullender
GregHullender
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What do your friends want you to use?

0
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Paulalock

Depends where we are and what we are asking for. If I am in a place where I know the staff I would just say "ponme una cerveza por fa" - probably sounds abrupt to some but here in Andalucia it's fine. Me gustaría is better for more formal occasions and not as "cursi" as quisiera LOL.

3
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Roger_Burke

When I was traveling through Andalucia, I read a guide book on Spain that said that Andalucianos are very curt in their speech. This is true of the speech but by and large they are also very friendly.

1
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/BenTurner93

Right, so because Quisiera is being used in the present sense of "I would like" but is technically a past subjunctive, the other clause in the sentence also has to use the past subjunctive to represent the present. So while the sentence technically means something like: "I wanted that you wented to university" It idiomatically means "I would like you to go to university" Am I right?

2
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Joseph2
Joseph2
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I think the whole "would like" translation is iffy. If you think of "would like" as present conditional, then the past-tense form of it is "would have liked". Would, should, could, might, and all those other helping verbs' past forms are would have, should have, could have, etc. This is doubly confusing because "would" seems to suggest the conditional tense and "have" suggests the present perfect tense. In actuality, we're dealing with the past subjunctive. So it can all get very confusing very fast.

1) "I would like you to go to college" is really just simple present (subjunctive). "I want you to go to college." "I want that you go to college." It's all essentially the same.

2) It's different than "I would have liked you to go to college" ("I wanted you to go to college" or "I wanted that you went to college"), which is its past tense form.

What nobody seems to know is which one of those two this sentence means. If it means "I want you to go to college", then how do you say, "I would have wanted for you to go college"?

3
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/AndyNZ

Well expressed analysis. Thanks for contributing. :-)

Cheers, Andy.

0
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
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Check the definition of "would" it isn't just for the present. It is a lot like "quisiera" http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/would

0
Reply2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
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Please remember that "to go" is an infinitive which has no tense. It is timeless. It can be used for any tense, because he may or may not go now or in the future or even in the past he may or may not have gone, but we wish in the past, present or future.

There is no past subjunctive in English "went" is not used unless it is indicative. "wanted" is not in past subjunctive mood either. The alternate for 1 would be "I would like that you go to college."

The perfect subjunctive exists in Spanish and that is where you would use the first sentence from 2, but the second sentence is not in subjunctive at all. It's alternate would be "I would have liked you to have gone to college." or "I would have liked that you go to college." The last "go" is not present indicative. It is subjunctive.

0
Reply2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Rickydito

BenTurner93: Looks good to me.

0
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Talca
Talca
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"I would have liked you to have gone to the university." Why is this not accepted? "fueras" is imperfect subjunctive. How can it be translated "to go"? Alternatively, "I would have liked that you had gone to the university."

2
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Elizabeth0

Both of your sentences are in perfect tense, but the Spanish sentence is not. That would need to be something like "Yo habría querido que fueras a la universidad."

The fact that "fueras" is in the imperfect has nothing to do with its real tense. It is only in the imperfect tense because the main verb, quisiera, is. The actual tense, or rather time, of fueras could be at the same time as the quisiera is taking place or afterward as this site (http://spanish.about.com/od/verbmoods/a/subjunctive_tenses.htm) tells us:

  • "If the main verb is in the preterite, imperfect [which quisiera is], past perfect or conditional tense, and the dependent (subjunctive) verb [fueras] refers to action that takes place (whether in actuality or not) at the same time or after the action of the main verb, then the imperfect subjunctive is used. Example: Esperé que comieras. (I expected you to eat.)"

Now, quisiera can mean a wanting in the present, it's technically in imperfect tense, but it is still used to politely express a present action (and "would like" is the more polite way we say it in English even though we don't actually mean it to be conditional on anything). Therefore, since that quisiera can be describing a current want, that means that fueras (which either takes place at the same time or after the action of the main verb, a current wanting) is also in the present tense or something you want to happen at a later time. So if we translate the first part to be "I would (currently) like", which is perfectly legit, then the fueras means 'to go' either immediately or at a later time. "I would like you to go to college." And that encompasses both the present, "I would like you to go to college...now.", and a future time, "I would like you to go to college...next year."

9
Reply14 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/IshtarmuzI

In the above analysis I can see where you could accept the "to go" as Duolingo has, however, I am at a loss as to why the "were going" or "gone" would be rejected.

1
Reply14 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
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There are a ton more past subjunctive tenses to learn including past perfect versions. "to go" is not a present tense. It is the infinitive which is timeless. http://conjugator.reverso.net/conjugation-english-verb-go.html http://conjugator.reverso.net/conjugation-spanish-verb-ir.html

0
Reply2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ericfoley

I would translate the sentence: "I would like it if you were going to college" or, "I would like it if you were attending university". What meaning is lost from the spanish in either of these translations. Does this type of exercise work well for the subjunctive?

2
Reply14 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Elizabeth0

I think that may lose the possibility of meaning going to college in the future. Those two sentences are just talking about going to college in the present (wishing they were already there attending college), but according to the site I quoted at the top, I think the Spanish includes both the possibility of present and future.

Maybe if you said something like, "I would like it if you were to go to college" that might be accurate (but probably not accepted by Duolingo).

0
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tejano
tejano
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No, actually it does not lose the possibility of meaning an occurrence in the future. The given construct covers both instances, depending on context, understanding or explicit expression:

"I would like it if you were going to college right now."

"I would like it if you were going to college this coming semester."

3
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SamuelOrr

"I would like that you went to the university" was accepted even though it is tortured English.

1
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Linda_from_NJ

I always use word "if," which is sometimes and indicator of the subjunctive in English, as well as the placeholder "it" in subjunctive sentences like these. "I would like it if you went to the university." I always get marked as right. Just remember, it doesn't work the same way when translating back to Spanish. ;)

0
Reply1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Pigslew
Pigslew
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I tried the natural, but non-literal "I wanted you to go to college", without success.

1
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/wazzie
wazzie
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After thinking (and referencing) this a bit, I think that would be, "Quise que tú fueras a la universidad."
Using the preterit here, we make the wanting a completed task.

Thoughts?

1
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/AlexisLinguist
AlexisLinguist
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No need for this post. Corrected.

0
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Linda_from_NJ

I believe that the "que" is part of what makes it subjunctive in Spanish.

0
Reply1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/gernt
gernt
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"I want you to go to the university" worked.

0
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/IshtarmuzI

which just seems wrong to me

2
Reply4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
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"Quisiera" and "would like" can be used to request in the present as well as indicate the past.

0
Reply2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/IshtarmuzI

Would not, "I wish that you were going to college." be more correct as past subjunctive?

1
Reply14 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
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In English, we rarely use the subjunctive. We prefer to use the infinitive whenever we can. I suppose that it could be correct, just rarely used. So, how to get people to understand that when we use the infinitive in Spanish you must use the subjunctive? This is why we have sentences like this.

-1
Reply2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jellonz
jellonz
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Thought this might be asking the bleeding obvious, but after reading through this discussion it seems nobody else has asked it yet: Would it be Ok to use the present subjunctive, "quiera," instead of "quisiera?" I'm guessing the "to go" would also have to match tense, so maybe "Yo quiera [que] tú vayas a la universidad." If this is incorrect, then when is the present subjunctive used?

1
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SMAGringo

I think the purpose of this particular exercise is to introduce the imperfect subjunctive of Querer. The imperfect subjunctive of querer and poder operate a bit differently than might seem by direct translation. Querer in the imperfect subjunctive translates as a much more polite way to ask if someone wants something. It moves from "I want a cup of coffee", certainly direct and clear, to I would like a cup of coffee" My text indicates it is used to be more courteous.
Similarly, if you ask a person "Can you wash the windows" Puede limpiar las ventanas" it is clear and direct, but it is much more courteous to ask "Could you wash the windows? (or, more exactly, if you could, would you wash the windows". Less direct, but a far more gallant way to ask for help. Si quisieras, limpiarías las ventanas", which actually translates as "Could you wash the windows"

0
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jellonz
jellonz
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Gracias, but I understand the usage of "quisiera" here. What I was wondering is can the present subjunctive "quiera" be used similarly. And if not, in what situations would it be used?

0
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SMAGringo

The present subjunctive would not translate as I would like, that would be more like the conditional tense, querría. Querer is not so much used IN the subjunctive (though it is, and when it is, it translates as the present tense) as it sets up the condition to USE the subjunctive.

0
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jellonz
jellonz
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So how does "quiera" translate and when is it used?

0
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SMAGringo

Like all present subjunctive, it translates the same as the present tense...it is just telling you there is a "mood" that is different.

1
3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tomigaoka

this is a mood, something that is Irreal or impossible. for sure the translation is wrong in english. but grammar wise, an imperfect subjunctive tense always go with an imperfect subjunctive tense...

1
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
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Except that there is no imperfect subjunctive tense in Englsih. We prefer to use the timeless infinitive.

-1
Reply2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Car230
Car230
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This is amazing

1
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/DaagaFrank
DaagaFrank
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Why not: "I would want you to go to the university"? I'm not a native english speaker and i don't know what is wrong with this translation... thanks!

1
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jellonz
jellonz
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I think that would use the conditional tense "querría".

0
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/DaagaFrank
DaagaFrank
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I have seen some texts where they translate "I would like" as "yo quisiera"... this made me think i could use it in that way :s whatever... something more that I've learnt (perdón si tuve muchos errores al escribir) Thanks!

1
Reply3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jellonz
jellonz
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"I would like" is fine, but "I would want" changes the meaning to the conditional in English. For example: "I would like some cake" is just a polite way of saying "I want some cake" whereas "I would want some cake ..." requires a condition "... if it were chocolate." What's confusing is that we commonly say things like "I would like some cake if it is chocolate" which is kind of a polite conditional hybrid that mixes tenses and conditionals and grammarian's probably hate it, but it sounds very natural. Anyway, to clarify the main point: "Would like" = polite "want." whereas "Would want" = conditional "want."

1
Reply3 years ago