1. Forum
  2. >
  3. Topic: Swedish
  4. >
  5. "Ingenjören presenterar sitt …

"Ingenjören presenterar sitt arbete."

Translation:The engineer presents his work.

February 26, 2015

42 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Nero-Germanicus

Is there any way to tell here if the engineer is male or female?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/torg

No, "en ingenjör" could be a man or a woman.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Nero-Germanicus

Thanks for the reply, but I was thinking about the word "sitt". Is it like saying in English: "the engineer presents its work"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Arnauti

Yes, sort of. You must say sitt if it's the engineer's own work, and then you don't get to gender the engineer. If you say hans or hennes, it can't be that engineer's own work.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/g.uh

It works for all professions ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Anrui

Sin/sitt/sina work for all subjects.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Michael990548

You never refer to a person as "it,"(at least in U.S. English) it is considered dehumanizing and an insult. You either have to specify gender or use "their".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KarasuGamma

I'm pretty sure that wasn't the intent of that comment. It was more likely a simple commentary on the ambiguity of "sitt".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/allenfrang

Yeah but l do think it's relevant. "Their" is used as a translation to "sitt" or "sin"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Michael990548

Like Allenfrang said, I didn't mean to say that the person meant it as an insult. I was just saying that "it" wouldn't always be a translation of sin/sitt.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kiomarv7

Actually in American legal texts, especially case law, defendants and plaintiffs are sometimes referred to as "it" to draw general rules so that the rules do not appear to apply only to a single sex.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kiteo

Wow, as if the old-fashioned and now new-fashioned their was somehow worse than a dehumanising term. I really dislike the legal culture.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KiwiDressager

Does it bother anyone else that the primary suggested answer is "HIS work"? Given the gender of the engineer is not specified it should really be "THEIR work" or at least offer his and her as equal options.

(Feminist rant over!)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/devalanteriel

It would have bothered me, but I know that the course has been developed with gender issues constantly in mind. If you run into a sentence with a job, the chances of the person being gendered male is just the same as of them being gendered female. We take this very seriously, and we're proud to offer an equality-friendly learning environment in regards to both gender and sexuality.

We'd have used "his" and "her" as mutual defaults for every sentence, but there's a technical reason that forces us to choose between them. Duolingo automatically picks the default translation for the reverse exercise (the "Translate into Swedish" one), and there is no option to separate them. In other words, if we added both "his" and "her" as a default here, you might get asked to translate "The engineer presents her work" and be told that you got it wrong for writing hennes.

You just happened to run into a sentence with a male engineer. In a few minutes, you may run into a female doctor, or a male nurse, or a female prime minister. :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KiwiDressager

Having now completed the tree I can attest to the clear gender neutrality throughout the course and withdraw any concerns I may have had about this specific sentence! :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KiwiDressager

That is very true. I have noticed that generally the sentences are constructed in a gender neutral manner or rather without a sexist bias. Which is why it seemed odd that this one had a male engineer as the preferred sentence. I would've thought that the most correct sentence here would be "their" given that we do not know the gender of the engineer. It isn't that a possible answer was him rather than her but that it is given as the preferred/suggested answer.

I definitely appreciate the gender neutrality throughout the course and it does not go unnoticed! Trans pronouns are a whole other issue but one that I am not ready to learn in Swedish yet as I have so far to go to reach even a semblance of fluency! Far too tricky for me right now!

The moderators do a fantastic job, this course is really fantastic. (Sorry to nitpick!)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/devalanteriel

Right, if we add multiple defaults then Duolingo will choose between them at random, which would have been perfect - if it weren't for that reverse sentences would occasionally become grammatically incorrect without any option to improve it. So until we have such a system in place, we'll have to do with alternating between his and her. I mean, as much as I'm all pro gender neutrality, teaching han and hon is very important in a language course as well.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DarkMoonFire

Certainly doesn't bother me.
His/her/their are all equally correct..... one of them has to be at the top of the list.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Leslie_Blue

Why can I not use introduces instead of presents here?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Arnauti

There's a great answer to this by JoelWibron in this thread: https://www.duolingo.com/comment/11116612


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HPFoley

In presenterar, it sounds like the first two e's are short e's, and the last one is a long e. How do we know when to use which?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Arnauti

A simplified description is that vowels are short when they are unstressed or followed by double consonants, and long when they're stressed and at the same time not followed by double consonants. This is very simplified, but it's a start.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HPFoley

Thank you Arnauti.

Between when I posted the comment and now I purchased a copy of Essentials of Swedish Grammar. It cleared up most of my pronunciation questions, but it left one question unanswered. It said that 'å' is pronounced like the 'ou' in "ought." However, sometimes it sounds to me a bit like the 'oa' in "loan." Am I just hearing it incorrectly, or is it ever pronounced as such?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Arnauti

There's a diphtong in loan, this you can hear in the Swedish spoken in Scania in the south of Sweden.
I checked a phonetics site which tells me "loan" is [loʊn] in American English and [ləʊn] in British English. If you hear an [o] sound, that's totally right, but I can't really think of a case where it would be [ə].


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Zalorian

Well, my answer was perfect, but I used "project" instead of "work" and that was taken as an error. Was "project" really wrong?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Anrui

Yes,

Project - Projekt
Work - Arbete


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/fergusincoronato

I used "shows" instead of "presents" and that was taken as an error. Was "shows" wrong in thia context?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DarkMoonFire

I'm not native, so I could be wrong..... but...... to say "shows his work" would be "visar sitt arbete".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Michael990548

It says "own job" yet "occupation" is not excepted. Is there a difference?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Bruno_108

I take it that if this had been more in context and we had known the gender of the engineer, we would have said "sin arbete", right?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Arnauti

No, it's sitt arbete because arbete is an ett word. If it had been a book instead, it would have been sin bok in the same sentence.
sin/sitt/sina is used to refer back to the subject when the subject is the third person (he, she, they).
So it would still be Hon presenterar sitt arbete or Han presenterar sitt arbete if we knew their genders.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Bruno_108

Oh right! Somehow I always thought sin/sitt/sina agreed with the 'gender' of the subject, that's why I couldn't make out why an -en word like 'ingenjören' would have a sitt attached to it. Thank you so much for clarifying this :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mattheworb

does "presenterar" also mean "is/are presenting" like most of the verbs we have learned?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kiomarv7

Should the "s" in "sitt" be pronounced as the voiceless postalveolo-velar fricative ɧ since the preceding word ends with an "r"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/devalanteriel

I never do. Arnauti always does. There appears to be some variation, but you can't say either is strictly wrong or right. :)

Edit: Or maybe it's a ʂ, I haven't had enough coffee to tell yet.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Himmel.

Can sin' be replace with sitt' in the sentence?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/devalanteriel

It's always sitt, because arbete is an ett-word.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CedSgm7N

The pronunciation of 'ingenjoren' in this exercise seems to be wrong. It sounds like she's saying 'inphwen' instead of 'inyen' - or is it a regional accent for certain parts of Sweden?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/devalanteriel

The TTS uses the most common pronunciation here. You can use either the sj-sound or the tj-sound. Some French loans have Swedified forms of the French g, hence the non-standard sounds.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CedSgm7N

You are always so helpful and it's much appreciated. Thank You!

Learn Swedish in just 5 minutes a day. For free.