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  5. "Çocuk ekmek yer."

"Çocuk ekmek yer."

Translation:The child eats bread.

March 24, 2015

25 Comments

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https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ems22340

Why is the indefinite article "bir" not necessary here?

March 24, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LiliumAgri

"The child" not "a child." (Unless you're asking why you don't say "bir ekmek," which would mean the kid eats a whole loaf of bread on her own. Growing girl!)

March 24, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ems22340

It told me I was wrong because the correct translation was "A child eats bread". Must have been a bug.

March 24, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Selcen_Ozturk

you should say either "the child" or "a child" as you need to use an article here; so if you just wrote "child", you would see this message

March 24, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ems22340

So if you want to talk about "A child", "bir" is optional? Like, only necessary when the indefiniteness is important?

March 24, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Selcen_Ozturk

yes!

March 24, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/heatherlp4

Thank you! So does that always happen with words ending in 'r'? Should I be trying to copy that sound?

March 27, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LiliumAgri

Before grammatical pauses and especially sentence finally it tends to happen, yeah, and some speakers do it more and more consistently than others. It also happens with /v/ and /z/ a bit, and more rarely (not in this TTS I think) with /l/.

For these guys, it's not a complete devoicing (like, you can still tell the differences between sentence final /f/ and sentence final /v/, sentence final /z/ and sentence final /s/) These are not conscious phonological process for Turks, however, and so you see a lot of variability in accents and speakers.

Moreover, if you DON'T devoice nobody will misunderstand you or think you're wrong. I start unconsciously picking this up after ~3 years of Turkish I think (my first year living with natives). Sort of the same way my husband started picking up English word-medial /t/-to-glottal stops (words like kitten, mountain) after living among native speakers. Nobody ever told me to correct, and nobody thought he had bad pronunciation. It's just something you can pick up to refine your accent in time, but I don't think it's a good one to concentrate on at first.

Contrast these to the sentence final devoicing of stops and c in multisyllable nouns (b to p, d to t, ğ/g to k, c to ç) that happens consciously and grammatically. Those are the ones you have to concentrate on to be understood, and luckily they area consistently marked in written text as part of standard Turkish. The voiceless word final stops and ç will get voiced when a vowel follows them: kitap--kitabım (my book), ağaç--ağacım (my tree), etc. Saying kitap-ım will potentially not be understood. If you say ağaç-ım people will assume you're saying "açım" (I am hungry).

March 27, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sycare38

Where is the "the" in sentence. I know Çocuk is child, ekmek is bread, and yer is eat/eats. So where is the "the"? Is it hidden? Or just not exist and the listener/speaker should know from context?

April 2, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LiliumAgri

Context. Turkish doesn't have a definite article, only an indefinite one. If it was important for it to be understood as a child it would be "bir çoçuk ekmek yer."

April 2, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sycare38

Thankyou! :)

April 3, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dosadnizub

Can we agree to skip the article in the english translation if it is not present in turkish sentence? There's only so much english nuances I want to master learning turkish :P

March 25, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LiliumAgri

It's all English's fault, really. Turkish actually tries to minimize your use of articles, doesn't even USE a definite article. That's a language trying to do a guy a solid.

But English has to be all "articles EVERYWHERE with COMPLICATED RULES and even though it's super sophisticated, native speakers think it should be easy and think you're DUMB if you make mistakes."

So unfortunately, no -- you do have to think about it because articles aren't expressed in Turkish but have to be expressed in English.

March 25, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TobyBartels

French is worse.

March 25, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tom-Morgan

And in my limited experience, Portuguese even more so.

April 25, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Bush6984

The pronunciation of "Çocuk" sounds kind of as if the "o" is pronounced "front" like a German "ö" rather than a "back" "o." Is this understanding/interpretation correct? Is this a consistent pattern, that "o" in Turkish is always pronounced this way, or is this merely a case of context of this word/sentence?

March 25, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LiliumAgri

I can't comment as to the exact location of the German front ö vs the Turkish ö/o. However, I definitely hear it as the back o, no problem with TTS this time. There would definitely be a world of difference between çocuk and çöcuk.

March 25, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/heatherlp4

The 'yer' at the end sounded as if it was 'yerac'. What was the extra sound?

March 27, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LiliumAgri

The "r" sound in Turkish has the tongue approach the roof of the mouth but not quite touch, or touch very light and quick. Especially when "r" comes at the end of a word the tongue gets so close that the air coming over it makes a hissing sound like an "sh," and the vocal cords stop moving at the word's end (it's a devoiced r, that is), so it's harder to hear it as being a "r" sound.

March 27, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/leomoiin02

i heard that too

November 16, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BaThel01

is the verb always placed at the end of a sentence??

November 7, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlexinNotTurkey

Yep :)

November 7, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Patriek8

The child eats the bread. İs that right too?

March 9, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tomatnee

I have spelled 'eat' not 'eats' and it haven't worked. Why would it check my english skills though?

July 27, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MAHMOODD1

hi

February 11, 2019
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