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  5. "Ben o elmaları yerim."

"Ben o elmaları yerim."

Translation:I eat those apples.

March 25, 2015

66 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jrikhal

So the accusative suffix is needed even if the o (those) already serves as determiner. Am I right?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/p7CH3

The question is also interested me. Why we need "ı''? Because ''o'' is kind of "the"? Isn't it?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TerriRogers

I'm confused. I thought those is sunlar. I don't understand the o


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Selcen_Ozturk

those can be onlar/şunlar or o/şu

  • Those apples: o elmalar/şu elmalar
  • Those are apples: onlar elma/şunlar elma

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Narunata

I'm still kinda confused.. (like) .. As far as I could understand, only one item should be in plural (the determiner o/şu OR the word 'apple') .. but.. I couldn't get the distinction between "those are apples" and "those ARE apples".. what changes grammatically? ♠ (thank ya) ♠ ®


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pharesdiego

I think it's because in the sentece "Onlar elma" or "şunlar elma" both "Onlar" and "şunlar" work as pronouns. So it is like if I say "They..." we in English need to put the verb to be, but remember turkish does not.

Those apples: o elmalar/şu elmalar "O" and "şu" work as determinative, so the meanings should be: those


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/eman25437
<h1>So when we use "O/şu" as pronouns this will be:</h1>

This is an apple=o bir elma

<h1>And when we use them as determinative this eill be:</h1>

This apple=o elma

Is this correct?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JuliaMVA

Why elmaları and not just elmalar?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rubahzabad

Yes I have the same question ..


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/docean

It is the accusative case. There are specific apples being referred to.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IoannisJoh

those = o these = ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrHilmiNevzat

"Ben o elmaları yerim." Translation: I eat those apples.

The Turkish question says "elmaları" = Plural.

Elma + plural suffix "-lar" + (accusative) case suffix "-ı" back vowel.

Translated to English, you cannot write "that" apples only "those" apples.

That - (singular) those (plural) are demonstrative pronouns. As the direct object is plural "those" is the correct pronoun to use.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mariane584083

Hello Hilmi, please, don't offend but in the sentence 'ben o elmalari yerim"="i eat those apples", "o"="those" is a demonstrative adjective, modifying the plural noun "apples". In the sentence that Selcen proposes above, "onlar elmalar"="those are apples", "onlar"="those" is a demonstrative pronoun, subject, modifying a verb. Do you agree?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mariane584083

A very clear and usefull web site on demonstrative determinants in english grammar: https://www.grammar-monster.com/glossary/demonstrative_adjective.htm


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrHilmiNevzat

Hello Mariane.

"Ben o elmaları yerim." Translation:I eat those apples.

Onlar elmalar - Those are apples. - Wrong. The plural noun does not require the object to have the plural suffix.

Onlar elma - Those are apple. - Literal translation. The object is made plural for the English translation answer only. Otherwise it does not make sense. Onlar elma - Those are apples. - Correct.

Ben o elmayi yerim - I eat that apple. - Correct answer for 1st person (singular)

Ye - Eat.

Yer - Eats. Yer + "im" (possessive) suffix for "I eat."

Thank you.

Please see my Demonstrative pronouns - "İşaret zamirleri" tips & notes below on this forum.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mariane584083

Thanks Hilmi, "onlar elma" of course. I did write too fast!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/docean

Is "I'll eat those apples" a valid translation?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/franistart

It is not because I'll is short for I will, which is a different tense than present.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/docean

"Yerim" is most used to signal intention to eat (this is generally the case with this tense in Turkish) which is captured in English by "I will".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BryanKeith5

I have the same question. That was my translation as well.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JonasHanse3

If i were to say "bunlar elmalar" does it correctly translate to these are apples?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BartStif

Wasn't "O" he/she/it? Now means also those? :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrHilmiNevzat

Good morning BartStif

"Ben o elmaları yerim." Translation: I eat those apples.

"O" Gender free personal pronoun for: He/she/it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrHilmiNevzat

Demonstrative pronouns. These are the pronouns used for objects instead of people.

This - bu.

That (between this and that) şu

That - O

These - bunlar.

Those (between these and those) şunlar

Those - onlar.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mariane584083

In French, the demonstrative pronouns this (singular) and these (plural) are used to refer to something that is here / near. That (singular) and those (plural) to refer to something that is there / far. And for a further object we have another demonstrative pronoun.

I read in a türkish grammar website (university of Rennes in France) that "bu" is used for near object, "su" for far objetc and "o" for further object. Are there these types of nuances in türkish language? Is there ten same in Türkish.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/saltanat84111

What else does o mean in turkish is it just tgose or you can use it in a other sentences


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrHilmiNevzat

saltanat84111

Hello

"O" - personal pronoun: he/she/it. When used as a demonstrative pronoun for objects not people it becomes "that" & "those."

Examples:

"Şu ev üç odalıdır." Translation: That house has three rooms.

O şarkı bitti - That song has finished.

O fotoğraf yırtıldı - That photo is torn.

O numara silindi - That number is erased/deleted.

Anılar? - memories?

Thank you.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mariane584083

Hilmi! Why not "O ev üç adalidir" too?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrHilmiNevzat

Good morning Mariane.

"Şu ev üç odalıdır." Translation: That house has three rooms.

Because the Turkish question is referring to a non - human object & "üç" is a quantifying adjective describing the number of rooms the house has. The "-dır" suffix emphasizes the house room numbers.

Şu - "that" when used as a demonstrative pronoun for non - human objects.

The 3rd person ending -DIR suffix is often left out. It can be used to emphasise, make a contrast or indicate an assumption about a person in question.

Kind regards.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mariane584083

Saltanat, do read the comment of Himi above, please.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/fireweeds

With permission, I went through the possible variations (I may even have forgotten some) and wondering if you could comment on which ones are correct and which ones incorrect. Perhaps it helps to put them all out there in comparison. Ben elmayı yerim I eat the apple Ben elmaları yerim I eat the apples
Ben o elmayı yerim I eat this apple
Ben o elmaları yerim I eat these apples
Ben onlar elmalar yerim I eat these apples
Ben onlar elmaları yerim I eat these apples


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrHilmiNevzat

fireweeds

Good morning.

Turkish word order - “Türkçe söz dizimi.”

Subject / time expression / place expression / object / verb.

The definite direct object can move anywhere before the verb. It is recognised by the accusative case suffix. The indefinite, direct object in the nominative case always goes immediately before the verb.

Ben elmayı yerim. - "I eat the apple." - Correct.

Ben elmaları yerim & elmaları yerim - I eat the apples. - Correct.

Ben o elmayı yerim. - I eat this/that apple. "O" - when used as a demonstrative pronoun for non - human objects. - Correct.

Ben onlar elmalar yerim. - I eat these apples. - Wrong.

Ben - "I" or "me."

Onlar - "them."

Onlar elma yer. - They eat apples. - Correct. The indefinite, direct object in the nominative case (elma) always goes immediately before the verb.

Ben onlar elmaları yerim. - I eat these apples. - Wrong. You have muddled up your personal pronouns here.

I am posting you Turkish grammar examples on the (genitive) case & (plurals) in Turkish.

Kind regards.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/fireweeds

MrHilmiNevzat, thank you very much! I see now why my incorrect examples were incorrect! This also helped me much in understanding the difference between onlar and o!!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrHilmiNevzat

fireweeds

Rica ederim! - You're welcome!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrHilmiNevzat

fireweeds

Turkish grammar.

Turkish personal pronouns for: I, you, he, she or it being put into the “genitive” case ending. I becomes “my” or “mine.” You becomes “your” or “yours.” Singular or informal.

Turkish personal pronouns being put into the "genitive" case. According to 4 way vowel harmony. I, you, she, he & it. (n) in, (n) ın, (n) un & (n) ün. Buffer consonant (n)

(Singular) 1st person - benim.

(Plural) 1st person - bizim.

(Singular) 2nd person - senin.

(Plural) 2nd person - sizin.

(Singular) 3rd person - onun.

(Plural) 3rd person - onların.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrHilmiNevzat

fireweeds

[Grammar] One size doesn't fit all: Use of singulars & plurals in Turkish & English.

Selcen_Ozturk (miss)

In Turkish, if you have a general direct object, there is no need to put any case or suffix on the object itself. A general direct object is one that uses “a/an” or the plural without “the.” If you want to be specific, you can add the numeral bir to makes sure that the meaning “a/an” is given.

In general, we love using singular objects & everything is countable in Turkish, water, oil, sugar, bread, air, anything you can imagine having a plural form too. For example: The men eat an apple: Adamlar (bir) elma yer.

The men eat the apples: Adamlar elmaları yer.

The men eat the apple: Adamlar elmayı yer.

The men eat apples: Adamlar elma yer. Adamlar elmalar yer is simply wrong in Turkish.

The men eat apple: This sentence is wrong in English, you cannot use a singular countable object without an article (or other determiners)

The men eat five apples: Adamlar beş elma yer. Adamlar beş elmalar yer is simply wrong in Turkish.

The men eat a lot of apples: Adamlar çok elma yer.

Adamlar çok elmalar yer is simply wrong in Turkish.

Selcen_Ozturk (miss)

These examples have been provided by (miss) & are not mine.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mariane584083

Hilmi, i don't understand what you mean writing this: "In general, we love using singular objects & everything is countable in Turkish, water, oil, sugar, bread, air, anything you can imagine having a plural form too". Those 5 words aren't they uncoutable word, without any pural form? Please, clarify. Thank you.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrHilmiNevzat

Hello Mariane

[Grammar] One size doesn't fit all: Use of singulars & plurals in Turkish & English.

Selcen_Ozturk (miss)

She is a deactivated (MOD) Selcen_Ozturk (miss)

The tips & notes were prepared by Duo & I just use them as grammar guides. Please read the whole page a few times before the "light" bulb switches on in your brain.

That was a polite compliment (I hope so)

Kind regards.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mariane584083

Hilmi, i'm despairing! i did find the tips and notes previously but today, i can't remember how. Please, would you send me the link and i shall notice it in my note book.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrHilmiNevzat

Good morning Mariane

Please do not despair.

[Grammar] One size doesn't fit all: Use of singulars & plurals in Turkish & English.

Selcen_Ozturk

The link to these tips & notes are on the Duo plural topic. I cannot access it at the moment.

We can put out an SOS on the "discuss" site to get the link.

Kind regards.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrHilmiNevzat

Hello Mariane

I have posted a request on the Turkish to English "discuss" site. I am waiting for a reply.

Please can you check it occasionally for a response by other learners to the tips & notes request.

Kind regards.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/fuat646767

We can these suffixes for accusative after the word.

I or yı İ or yi U or yu Ü or yü


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/roji88sh

Please translate this two sentense 1 this is apple 2 this aple


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrHilmiNevzat

roji374660

Hello.

1 this is apple - Bu elmadir.

2 this aple - Bu elma.

Thank you.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SheydaYari

Im confused Please clarify which words mean: It, This, That, Those, these In turkish? Thanks


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrHilmiNevzat

SheydaYari

Hello.

"O" - personal pronoun meaning: he/she/it.

When used as a demonstrative pronoun for objects not people it becomes "that" & "those."

Examples:

"Şu ev üç odalıdır." Translation: That house has three rooms.

O şarkı bitti - That song has finished.

O fotoğraf yırtıldı - That photo is torn.

O numara silindi - That number is erased/deleted.

Anılar? - memories?

Thank you.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrHilmiNevzat

Demonstrative pronouns - "İşaret zamirleri."

Bu - This(one) Şu - This(one), that(one) O - That(one) Bunlar - These. Şunlar - These, those. Onlar - Those.

Enlightened note:

The plural form of the demonstrative pronouns take the plural suffix "-lar" & the letter "-n" is added before the suffix "-lar."

Examples:

Bu çok lezzetli. (This is very delicious.)

Şu ne kadar? (How much is that?)

O annemin. (That is my mother's.)

Bunlar çok lezzetli. (These are very delicious.)

Şunlar ne kadar? (How much are these?)

Onlar annemin. (Those are my mother's.)

When to use the demonstrative pronouns?

The three demonstrative pronouns & their derivatives are used to show an object to their distance.

  1. Usage of the pronoun "Bu." The demonstrative pronoun "bu" (this) & its case forms are used to show the closest object. Example: Bunu aldım. (I bought this.) ---> accusative case, singular. Bunları aldım. (I bought these.) ---> accusative case, plural.

  2. Usage of the pronoun "Şu" The demonstrative pronoun "şu" (this or that) & its case forms are used to show the object which is a little further away. Example: Şuna bak! (Look at this!) ---> dative case, singular. Şunlara bak! (Look at these!) ---> dative case, plural.

  3. Usage of the pronoun "O." The pronoun "o" is used for both personal (he, she, it) & as a demonstrative pronoun. The demonstrative pronoun "o" (that) has the same meaning as "şu." Example: Arkadaşım ondan aldı. (My friend bought from that.) ---> ablative case, singular. Arkadaşım onlardan aldı. (My friend bought from those.) ---> ablative case, plural.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JArgeles

Now, is the "a" in "lar" considered the last vowel (which makes the accusative marker "ı"), or is it always the last vowel in the root word that counts? Are there examples like this?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrHilmiNevzat

JArgeles

Hello.

"Ben o elmaları yerim." Translation: I eat those apples.

Now, is the "a" in "lar" considered the last vowel (which makes the accusative marker "ı"), or is it always the last vowel in the root word that counts? Are there examples like this?

"-Lar" is the plural suffix only although it contains a back vowel "-a." Depending on any case markers or suffixes being added to a word. Always look for the last vowel in the root word or the last consonant it ends in.

Elma - apple (root) - nominative case + plural suffix "-lar" becomes "elmalar" - "apples" + the accusative back vowel suffix "-ı" - "the apples."

Teşekkür ederim.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mariane584083

Hello Hilmi, may i add the link to Duolingo Turkish Grammar Portal on the topic of the plural rules: https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/7738412? Have a nice week!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnthonySpeakzz

why cant it be "i eat her/his apples."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrHilmiNevzat

AnthonySpeakzz

Hello.

"Ben o elmaları yerim." Translation: I eat those apples.

why cant it be "i eat her/his apples."

Onun elmalarını yerim. - I eat his/her apples.

Onun - (possessive pronoun) His/hers/its.

"That" is (singular) & "those" is (plural)

O - (demonstrative pronoun) - those.

O + (n) buffer + personal pronoun suffix (genitive) "-un" becomes - onun - "his/hers/its."

Thank you.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/OlavSurlan

To illustrate the complexity of this topic, here is my understanding of it so far. PLEASE CORRECT ME IF I AM WRONG!

O elma = that apple OR that is an apple OR it is an apple.

O bir elma = it is one apple OR it is an apple.

O elmalar = those apples.

Onlar elma = those are apples.

Onlar bir elma = they are one apple.

Onlar elmalar = they are apples.

şu elma = that apple OR that is an apple.

şu bir elma = that is an apple.

şu elmalar = those apples.

şunlar elma = those are apples.

şunlar bir elma = those are one apple.

şunlar elmalar = those are apples.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrHilmiNevzat

OlavSurlan

Hello.

Bunlar bir elma = these are one apple. - Wrong.

Bunlar elma - These are apples. - Correct. The Turkish noun (elma) remains singular.

Bu bir elma - This is an apple.

Bu elmalar = These apples - Correct.

Onlar bir elma = They are one apple. - Wrong.

O bir elma - That is an apple. When "o" is a demonstrative pronoun.

Şu elma - That apple.

Şu elmalar - Those apples. The plural suffix "-lar" changes "that" (singular) to "those" (plural)

Thank you for reading: Demonstrative pronouns - "İşaret zamirleri."

You need to revise your Turkish pronouns: turkishexplained.com

When you reach the top of the learning tree these topics are challenging: "Turkey," "Business" & "Science."

I think you are doing very well. Thank you very much.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SharonXiao

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