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  5. "The cats eat the fish."

"The cats eat the fish."

Translation:Kediler balığı yer.

March 27, 2015

38 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Alf42

Why is it "yer" here and not plural?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AneurinEE

You don't need to repeat the plural suffix when the noun already has it, and in fact I think I read one of the mods saying that actually the only time it's right to repeat the plural suffix is when the subject of the verb is people (e.g. kızlar balığı yerler would be okay according to this rule).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Alf42

Ok, I found it under the discussion of the copula.

"The suffix -lAr is optional in the 3rd person pl. However, it is only optional when referring to people. This suffix may not be used for items and animals. Only humans!"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ahmedfm85

Optional? When you say optional it makes me happy, because optional is easy! :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zahra748348

no i test it and write kediler yerler and it was okay but totally they dont use it not for humen not animals or anything purular it doesnt matter to them


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Alf42

You don't have to or you can if you want? I saw a sentence just now that did have the 3rd person plural verb ending with "men and women" as the subject.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AneurinEE

I think you probably shouldn't - it's redundant, and I can't think of times I've seen it except when people are the subject (but a native speaker may want to correct me).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/chabas1

I wrote "balıkları" for "the fish" and it was accepted, but I was wondering why "balığı" is also okay? Is there a rule ... ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Selcen_Ozturk

fish is both singular and plural in English


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MarcoStudenski

That is true, but the english sentence does not provide enough context. The question is poor.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlexinNotTurkey

We already added "balıkları" as an alternative (in fact, it was before the original question was even asked...at least a year ago). Both answers are correct


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mohammed981643

But I've read that the object can't take lAr, isn't this true?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

You're probably thinking of https://www.duolingo.com/comment/7736911 -- general direct objects don't take a plural suffix, but here, "the fish" is a specific direct object, not a general one (the fish = those particular fish, not just any fish).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CuriousDispo

Uhm, in English "fish" is singular and plural of one kind, but "fishes" is plural when you refer to different kinds of fish... ;-) http://dict.leo.org/ende/index_de.html#/search=fishes&searchLoc=0&resultOrder=basic&multiwordShowSingle=on


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Nick453874

"Fishes" is very informal. Any sort of official or educated writing would use "fish" for both singular and plural.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Edmek

How do you tell the difference between 'The cats eat the fish' and 'Cats eat the fish'?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KeremHakanAkyol

Unless it's accusative, you can't make a noun spesifically definite or indefinite. But in a talk, you'd easily sense if it's definite or not.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Leeano

so when do we use kedileri? I thought when there is "the"? but it was marked wrong


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AneurinEE

The -i on your example of kedileri would be the accusative suffix that you can use on the object of a sentence. In kediler balığı yer kediler is instead the subject of the sentence, so you can't use the accusative suffix. So kediler here could mean "cats", could mean " the cats", but that's not a determination you can make from the grammar with the subject of a sentence in Turkish, only with objects.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SarcasticPotato

is fish in this instance intended to be singular or plural?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

There's no way to tell, and so both translations are accepted.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jikalopa

How do i know that "the fish" refers to singular or plural,


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

How do i know that "the fish" refers to singular or plural

You can't. So both singular and plural translations should be accepted.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Feraso963

Why balığı not balik?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

"the fish" is definite (the fish, not just any fish) and it's the object of "yer" (eat).

Definite objects take the accusative case, and -ı is the accusative case ending here (and balık turns into balığ- when you add an ending that starts with a vowel).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rinimalawai

Why is "kediler" not "kedileri"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

Please see the comment threads started by dena57639 and Leeano on this page, and also https://www.duolingo.com/comment/7738396 , which explains the accusative case a bit (kedileri is the accusative case, kediler the nominative case).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

In this sentence, balığı, because it's (a) definite ("THE fish") and (b) a direct object (of the verb "eat"), so it takes the accusative case as appropriate for a definite direct object.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Qufrkss

Why Baliğı not balık


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

See the questions by Feraso963 a year ago and AliRaza618948 two months ago, and also https://www.duolingo.com/comment/7738396 which talks about the accusative in general.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dena1811

Why is it kediler and not kedileri? It is the cats right..


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

Yes, but it's not an object.

Only definite objects get the accusative case -- if either of those two conditions ("definite" or "object") doesn't apply, then no accusative for you :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Selcen_Ozturk

this is explained here, above your question. Always read the other comments before asking, to prevent clutter


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pari65

I think the word "yer" should be "yerler", means should be plural!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Selcen_Ozturk

please read the dicsussion before commenting, it doesn't have to be, and that's explained by others above

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