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  5. "Das Restaurant wird geschlos…

"Das Restaurant wird geschlossen sein."

Translation:The restaurant will be locked.

September 14, 2013

100 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/check2012

Why isn't this, "The restaurant will have closed"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kasra

Because that would be "Das Restaurant wird geschlossen haben." The auxiliary verb for schließen is haben: http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/schlie%C3%9Fen#German

This sentence is not really future perfect and doesn't really belong in this section. It's just the simple future tense, with sein as the main verb and geschlossen used as an adjective.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/solidgitarius

The auxiliary verb for schließen is haben

Or maybe the auxiliary verb is sein when the verb is used intransitively?

I see a line in the Duden that says:

geschlossen haben/sein

http://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/schlieszen


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/brandonjatkins

Based on this, I would agree with several things here. I have reported my thoughts and will summarize them here in hopes a native German grammarian will elaborate and correct as needed:

First, the accepted English answer "The restaurant will be closed." as kasra already indicated above is in fact the simple future in the passive voice. "Locked/closed" is a past participle functioning as an adjective. You can replace it with non-verb forms (e.g. "...on fire.", "...expensive.", etc.). to prove this is not part of the verb "will be". The correct future perfect form of this sentence is "The restaurant will have closed/locked." This too was an accepted answer for me which is good. It is intransitive so as solidgitarius pointed out it would seem this instance of geschlossen should take sein as it does in the question (German grammarians, please confirm).

Second, the English sentence "The restaurant will have been closed." is passive and I believe it is transitive since the restaurant itself is the object that someone or something will have closed. Admittedly the English grammar for future perfect passive transitive/intransitive is a bit fuzzy for me here, but I would expect as kasra stated that in this case geschlossen should take haben instead of sein. For example, "Er wird die Restaurant geschlossen haben." (He will have closed the restaurant.) versus "Das Restaurant wird [von ihm] geschlossen haben. (The restaurant will have been closed [by him]) verses "Das Restaurant wird geschlossen sein. (The restaurant will have closed... i.e. will have intransitively changed to the state of being closed).

Finally, "The restaurant will be closed." certainly has a very similar intent of meaning, and its literal translation may still be correct too. That is (and here again I need a German grammarian's help) if "geschlossen" is the correct past participle form for "closed" and "wird sein" is the correct simple future form for "will be". It would not be in the future perfect tense, but if those are true then there are two acceptable answers just in different tenses.

Please elaborate if I have butchered both of our languages.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jrgen792736

Ich würde sagen :"Das Restaurant wird geschlossen haben/sein. "und als Sachse eher: "Die Kneipe wird zu HAM." Entschuldigung aber eben eher "haben" als "sein" , wobei beides gebräuchlich ist.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kasra

I doubt that, @solidgitarius. The line you are referring to is among a list of ways in which the verb can be used. Most likely, "sein" is not meant as an auxiliary there.

In the more relevant part of the page you've linked to, they've cleared this up: starkes Verb; Perfektbildung mit »hat«


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/andrey420

Thanks, that explains a lot


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rowschank

This is Zustandspassiv, right? "Es ist geschlossen".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AFulgens

Well... in reality it's a future passive.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RogerioBL

Got the "gleiche" question. Danke für die Antwort :D


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Araucoforever

kasra, thank you so much for stating that this sentence is NOT Future Perfect tense.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/EofW
  • 2833

That's what I was given as the correct answer (as it marked mine - "the restaurant will have been closed" - as incorrect).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/az_p

There are two kinds of 'passive' sentences in German:

  1. Normal/process passive (Vorgangspassiv) uses werden as a helping verb and basically says "something gets done" but without specifying by whom. That's what your sentence is - "The restaurant will have been closed (by someone)". In German this sentence would be Das Restaurant wird geschlossen worden sein. If you need me to break this down, just ask in a comment.

  2. Conditional passive (Zustandspassiv) is actually a bit of a false name, because it's really just using the past participle of a verb as an adjective, and saying that something 'is' that adjective. It's only talking about the state that the thing is in, not so much the process of anything happening. Using "closed" as an adjective is an example of this. This fits with Duo's translation here.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LadyOra

Same here! Why isn't "The restaurant will have been closed" correct?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/hechap

az_p, Is "worden" a typo or a conjugation of "werden"? I cannot find it in the conjugation table I have for "werden" - just "geworden"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AdamKean

Sorry this is 5 months late, but I thought it would still be worth answering in case you or any other readers still had this question.

„Worden“ is a specific form of the verb „werden“ used exclusively in perfect tense passive clauses.

So basically, if you're happy with when you need to use „geworden“ (i.e. whenever you need the past participle), „worden“ is just an extension of that; whenever the sentence is in the passive voice.


Here are some examples of the various forms of „werden“ to try and give some context:

  • „Ich werde Ingenieur, da ich Ingenieurwesen studiere.“
  • "I'm going to be an engineer, as I'm studying engineering." potentially misleading translation alert

  • „Ich wurde Ingenieur, weil ich Ingenieurwesen studiert habe.“

  • "I became an engineer, because I studied engineering."

  • „Ich bin Ingenieur geworden, denn ich habe Ingenieurwesen studiert.“

  • "I became an engineer, because I studied engineering."

  • „Das Buch wird häufig gelesen.“

  • "The book is read frequently."

  • „Das Buch wurde häufig gelesen.“

  • "The book was read frequently."

  • „Das Buch ist häufig gelesen worden.“

  • "The book has been frequently read."

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pont

Duolingo just gave me "the restaurant will have closed" as the preferred correct translation. "The restaurant will be closed" was not listed as one of the possible translations, though of course those lists aren't usually exhaustive.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DonMartin1

"The restaurant will be closed" was correct for me 12/16/2014.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JayanthVarma

Because the original sentence uses sein, which means "to be". It says how the restaurant will be, which is "be closed" or be in a closed state, a closed restaurant; not what will have been done to it by someone, which is "having been closed".

In short it's the difference of being something (sein) or having been done something to it (haben). Correct me if I am wrong.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/justin981104

They are both correct, in English these phrases mean the same thing


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/UBK10

Compare “On Tuesday the restaurant will have closed” with “On Tuesday the restaurant will be closed”. The first makes it seem like they are out of business and closed permanently but the second refers to just that particular day. They may open again on Wednesday.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lizzy0127

Restaurant can't close itself..... haben geschlossen means differently


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/az_p

Ok, another trick sentence which is good for grammar enthusiasts but terrible for learning.

The confusion comes from this sentence seeming to have two possible meanings:

  1. "The restaurant will have closed" - This seems to be the expected answer, because the translation appears in the lesson on future perfect tense. Although it uses sein instead of haben, it could be argued that "closing" is a 'change of state' requiring the helping verb sein. Although, dictionaries like Duden and Canoo.net do not mention sein as a helping verb - that seems to be the 'trick'.

  2. "The restaurant will be closed/locked" - This meaning only becomes possible because geschlossen is not just the past participle of schließen ("to close"), but it is also an adjective meaning "closed/locked". If taken to be an adjective, then sein is no longer functioning as the helping verb in a future perfect construction, but just as itself ("be") in a standard future tense construction.

My question is, wouldn't the future perfect (and perfect) be better taught using non-ambiguous sentences? Here are some attempts of mine - corrections welcome.

  • Der Mann wird gerannt sein = "The man will have run". This is unambiguous as gerannt cannot be an adjective in this sentence.

  • Der Mann wird müde sein = "The man will be tired". This is unambiguous as müde cannot be a verb past participle.

However, true ambiguity could remain in other sentences that use sein as a helping verb where the verb past participle is also an adjective. As I understand it, Der Mann wird gestorben sein could mean either "The man will have died" or "The man will be dead". Is that correct?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BenHueb

"The man will be tired" is an interesting example because in English you run into the same exact problem. At any rate, shouldn't the translation be "The man will have been tired" to be truly future perfect?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KinanHabbal

are both haben and sein accepted in the restaurent will have closed?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/az_p

"will have closed" = wird geschlossen haben
"will be closed" = wird geschlossen sein

The meanings are obviously not entirely different, so Duolingo may accept one as the translation for the other, but those are the most direct ways to keep the grammar and emphasis intact.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ichKANN3

Hi az_p - Moderator, after reading all these comments and doing a little research to clear up my mind, I do understand and agree with this post of yours ... .... Thank You very much for all Your help .......... ............. ............... ....... ..... Just to sum up some of my findings: ....................................... ............... .........::::::::: :::::: (1) this verb SCHLIEßEN can be both INTRANSITIVE and TRANSITIVE: .......................................................................:: (1a) Per PONS.eu ...... schlie·ßen schließt, schloss, geschlossen [ˈʃli:sn̩] VERB intr ............................ ........................... ... .... Die Tür schließt nicht richtig === The door doesn't close properly ........... .................... .............SO "will have closed" = wird geschlossen haben is good ....... - although I had doubt before! .............. .... ........... ........... ...... ..............................::: (1b) Per PON.eu ........... schlie·ßen schließt, schloss, geschlossen [ˈʃli:sn̩] VERB trans .............................. ........... einen Betrieb/Laden schließen === to close down a factory/shop .......... ............. ............... ........As I understood, this is the most common meaning of this verb ... to close something, although TO CLOSE DOWN (i.e. to shut down, not open again because of heavy loss....) seems not as common an usage as just TO CLOSE ... .... .... .... ................. ............................... ................... ...........................:::: (2) Per dict.cc ............. to be closed === geschlossen SEIN ................. .................... ................ ........................... .................... ::: Per CONTEXT.reverso.net ............ Aber sein Büro wird geschlossen sein. === But his office will be closed. ........... ............. .................. ................................ ................. ::: Per Linguee.com .......... Du denkst z.B. "Ich will zum Buchladen gehen", aber dein Herz sagt dir: "Er wird geschlossen sein". (burhaniya.info ) === For example: You want to go to the bookstore, and your heart is telling you that it will be closed. ................... ............... ............... ......... SO ......... "will be closed" = wird geschlossen sein ...... is good. ......... ........ Once again, MANY THANKS for all Your Help. ...... ............. ............... PS.... I forgot how to make ITALICS for better reading. Hope some of You could remind me of how to do that.... THKS .......


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CapnDoug

See: https://www.duolingo.com/comment/12948453 for a list of all the formatting codes.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Juliefjw

closed is accepted but not 'shut' what is the difference?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LadyOra

Doors and windows can be both shut and closed, but places are just closed, IIRC.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kags
  • 233

I would use "shut" to described a business that is not open: "I couldn't get any milk as the shop was shut when I arrived".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Araucoforever

Again, this lesson is supposed to be about future perfect tense and Duo decided to put an example of Passive Voice. They love to confuse the students!! By the way, the correct translation should be: "the restaurant will be closed". I have never heard of using the word "locked"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kkulonja

Is this wrong: "The restaurant will have been closed."?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/az_p

Once we're getting to this more complex grammar, the meanings become quite specific and we need to be careful to translate accurately. "The restaurant will be closed" is talking about the state that the restaurant will be in, 'what it is'. "The restaurant will have been closed" is talking about the action that will have been done on the restaurant, 'what happened to it. The meaning is not totally different - you still won't be able to eat there, but both languages allow you to give specific emphasis to how you say it, and we are now learning how to keep that emphasis intact.

"The restaurant will be closed" = Das Restaurant wird geschlossen sein
"The restaurant will have been closed" = Das Restaurant wird geschlossen worden sein
"The restaurant will have closed" = Das Restaurant wird geschlossen haben


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Konrad-Michal

I wrote the same. Maybe our sentence would mean: Das Restaurant wird geschlossen gewesen sein?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DanyDin

why sein here and not haben it's not motion?!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/hedgehog_m

"sein" is for motion and for change of state


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DanyDin

oh i see do you've maybe few more examples of change of state when sein bentuzen instead? vielen dnak


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/hedgehog_m

ich bin geboren/ ich bin gestorben (as the brightest example of the change of state) on a smaller scale: i dunno, freezing/ unfreezing; becoming different... anything where the state changes.. also with sein: ich bin gewesen that's just from top of my head


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rowschank

Why not "The restaurant will have been closed"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/alfalfa2

See Kasra's explanation earlier in this queue.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/anna31102004

can somebody please tell when i should use "sein" and "haben". i always get confused !


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/az_p

Did you read Duolingo's lesson tips page? It explains a little bit, but also says that it just needs to be memorised for each verb. Some of the other comments on this page have advice too.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/QED-hamza-QED

I have read that verbs that don't need an object uses Sein...Is that correct??


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AdamKean

Unfortunately, it's not that simple.
It's possible you may have heard the following:

All verbs that take a direct object form the perfect tense with "haben".

And assumed that implied the opposite was also true—namely what you've asked. That is not the case. Funnily enough, the assertion I quoted is also not without its exceptions, but it's a much better rule of thumb than the rule you asked about.

I would simply recommend reading up on the matter, as there are no rules that cover 100% of the "sein" or "haben" verbs; however, a few rules can give you a very good idea of what's going on.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Erikman

I got it right with 'The restaurant will be closed,' but would 'The restaurant will close' work as well?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SteamWing

No, just like in the English sentences, there is a slight difference. "The restaurant will close" is "Das Restaurant wird schliessen."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Erikman

Good point. Thanks!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Nate_J

All you people confused about when to use "sein" vs "haben," the notes on this section actually give quite an adequate explanation.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/bogg22

For things like.… it is done.... What is the best translation.... Es ist gemacht/getan.... Or..... Es ist gemacht/getan worden?????


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/az_p

That's called 'passive voice'. It might be better explained in a later lesson...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlejandroZ672540

Am I wrong, or werden already means "will be" so it doesn't have to go with the verb sein?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/az_p

More like werden (here, wird) means "will". So in your analogy, sein is acting like "be".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/margaretnyc

The restaurant will be closed is more proper in English. Locked is when you tried to open the door.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/az_p

Either is fine. Geschlossen can mean either.

Perhaps, some prospective customers are more likely to be talking about whether the restaurant is 'closed' or not, but if it's a discussion amongst employees who are arriving at the beginning/end of trading hours they may be talking about whether the restaurant is 'locked' or not.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CapnDoug

From my research I find that "geschlossen" pretty much only means "closed" and that "locked" would be "verschlossen"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Annika449124

As a native German speaker I agree with you! geschlossen = closed and verschlossen = locked. I would have never thought to translate it as locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lizzy0127

I think in English, "be closed/have closed" is as confusing as "be opened/have opened". So I did some search on Google. However, it seems people asked more about "offen vs geöffnet", but not so many confusions about geschlossen.

I was wondering whether in German there's just some different usage between "open" and "close". So I found something on dict.cc. And apparently, "geschlossen" is widely used as an adjective "closed/concluded/shut/enclosed" (http://www.dict.cc/?s=geschlossen). However, "geöffnet" is anther story (link can't be displayed because of the umlaut.)

So I think, geschlossen can be used like offen in German, and here we should view it as an adjective. I may be wrong though.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/az_p

That seems accurate.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Huy_Ngo

Hey!! This is passive voice in simple future tense, not future perfect!!!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MichaelDow722454

My only choice of words in the translation given by Duo was "locked", "closed" was not a choice. Doesn't geschlossen mean "closed" and eingesperrt mean "locked"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CapnDoug

Yes, "geschlossen" means "closed". However, "eingesperrt" means "locked up", "imprisoned" or "trapped". "verschlossen" is "locked".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Flyinge

Locked in this context can also mean "abgeschlossen"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LawrenceDa807648

"The restaurant will be closed." is the answer to the above German sentence. The translation of being locked is "Das Restaurant wird abgeschlossen sein."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ElenaKosse1

Does sein not mean his?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AdamKean

Yes, sein can mean "his", but sein is also the infinitive of the English equivalent verb "to be".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/VladimirOlteanu

Hi! Is there any way to differentiate between "locked" and "permanently closed" (as in bankrupt)?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kartoffel_Mann

Duo predicted Corona!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DannyRWalker

I got a listening exercise for this one and the woman says what sounds like 'restauRAN' or even 'restauRANG', with a hard 'a', instead of the usual French-ish pronunciation I'm used to hearing in German.

Just wondering, then, whether this is a normal alternate pronunciation of 'restaurant' in German?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AdamKean

Well, this is news to me, but it seems German speakers use both
'Res - tor - ANG' and 'Res - tor - ɒ'; though I can only remember coming across the French pronunciation in my experience.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/5tk96

I thought that this sentence would be Future Perfect Continuous, that's why I wrote at first in English: The restaurant will have been closed. So, "wird geschlossen sein" is something like the Passive Voice of Future Simple?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AdamKean

I thought that this sentence would be Future Perfect Continuous, that's why I wrote at first in English: The restaurant will have been closed.

But future perfect continuous would be "The restaurant will have been closing".

So, "wird geschlossen sein" is something like the Passive Voice of Future Simple?

You can either think of it as the stative/statal passive in Futur I, or simply as a past participle (i.e. "geschlossen") being used as an adjective in Futur I.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LeahDawnMa1

Is "locked" being treated as an adjective here? Would the sentence look different if it were being treated as a verb, for example: "The restaurant will be locked by the manager"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MercedesEm13

closed sounds better


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/osmosiphobe

This activity does not belong here, except as a CONTRAST to future perfect. Future perfect is the past in the future (what will have been after some other time). This is simple future.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/paulma1960

Geschlossen means closed. For locked, use abgeschlossen.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Archer_Ararat

This is simply denglisch. It is wrong. A restaurant can not be locked but closed. The door of a restaurant can be locked! Trying to make linguistic discussions here is meaningless!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/osmosiphobe

Sorry, but no. This would be an example of a synechdoche, where a part of a unit stands for the whole of the thing. While the restaurant itself cannot be locked, because it is a cohesive unit, the door (a part of that cohesive unit) - as you say - can be. The door is what is important in this case, and stands in place of the whole restaurant in the expression. Locking the door IS locking the restaurant.

At any rate, the exercise asks very specifically for the words restaurant and door. It could have also said the restaurant will be driving, which would make no sense, but would still be a sentence a person could make if they knew the right words and the right order in which to put them.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/EmilCharli

A hyberrealism sentence in 2020/2021


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/EmilCharli

A hyperrealistic sentence in 2020/2021


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Alan432846

Having read through this forum and being no further forward with the various grammatical discussions, IMO this sentence is just wrong in translation! In any context a restuarant not being open closed is the only word that should be used! Unless of course some smart person comes up with an equally nonsensical alternate description that is!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kennedy248849

These discussions leave me more baffled than the original questions. I think I must be deeply stupid.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ClintRicke

All of the comments about the exact translation based on grammatical correctness are missing the point, I believe. It is not usual to refer to a restaurant as locked in English because you don't lock a restaurant. You would say the door to the restaurant is locked, the restaurant is closed, or the restaurant is locked up, but it is very odd to say the restaurant is locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Maldwyn7

geschlossen translates as closed and is confirmed in other questions. Locked translates as Ausgeschlossen.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ncd22124

Why "ss" in "geschlossen"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/az_p

That's just how you spell it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AdamKean

And to add to what az_p said (with over a four and a half year delay, I might add); it tells us that the "o" in "geschlossen" is pronounced short (like in Schloss) rather than long (like in Stoß).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Emsett

Is "the restaurant will be clubby" correct?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LadyOra

No, they mean "closed" literally, as in "their working hours have passed".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dunlainmiau

Why locked and not closed?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ralwoe

Most people think of a restaurant as being closed or open, instead of locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DarthSmokey

Why does it pronounce "wird" as "willt"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DeutschmitDuo

marked incorrect for "the restaurant will close"

What does this mean, "by the time we get there, the restaurant will be closed"?

That's the only difference between "the restaurant will be closed" and "the restaurant will be closed" I can think of.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/az_p

That's basically the meaning, yes.

Check your last sentence though - you said the same thing twice!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/hedgehog_m

the restaurant will have closed?? how can it be possible to guess such bad english??


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/alfalfa2

Why do you think this is bad English?

The wife says to her husband as they are driving, "Let's turn around. It's already 11:30. By the time we get there, the restaurant will have closed."

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