"I have more than him."

Translation:Tá níos mó agam ná é.

May 2, 2015

30 Comments

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https://www.duolingo.com/profile/YVONNEMCALEER

I strongly feel my answer 'tá níos mó agamsa ná atá aige' sounds much more natural than the prescribed answer. I don't think the translation really makes sense in Irish. If a pupil in my class wrote this I would correct it as a mistake.

May 29, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ainm10

I agree that what you wrote sounds better. More natural and also clearer.

April 27, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rewjeo
  • 1609

Is it wrong to use aige instead of é, or is that just more like "I have more than he has"?

May 2, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/scilling

It would be wrong to use ná aige to mean ná é (and vice versa). Ná é means only “than him” (i.e. “him” is among all that I have), and ná aige means only “than he (has)”.

May 3, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RozieToez

In American English tha vast majority of the time one says "I have more than him" what's meant is "I have more than he does." Even it were "it" instead of "him" the sentence would more likely mean "I have more than it does". If one were trying to say "I have more than just it" one would likelier say "I have more than that".

So when the lesson asks for "I have more than him" in Irish, should the answer Tá níos mó agam ná aige be considered a correct answer, or not? Because right now, it's marked incorrect.

September 20, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/scilling

In English, “I have more than it” would be ambiguous, since there’s no context to determine whether “it” is nominative or not; in that case, all of na é, na í, na aige, and na aici should be accepted for its Irish translation on Duolingo. “He” vs. “him” has the pronoun’s case to distinguish whether it’s nominative or not, so in my view ná aige in an isolated sentence should not be treated as a correct translation of “than him”. However, if the English sentence were found in context showing that “than him” was unmistakably used with a meaning of “than he (has)”, then ná aige should be considered correct and ná é should be considered incorrect.

September 20, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RozieToez

American informal usage in this case makes irrelevant the fact that "him" is in the objective case, when in formal mode it should rightly be in the subjective case. Usage trumps rules. In informal mode saying "I have more than he" would sound awkward and pedantic.

As such, without context I'd be inclined to always view "than him" in that sentence as meaning "than he does" as the likelihood anyone would mean they own more than just owning him is very uncommon. The only situation I can think of where that statement wouldn't be deeply offensive is in reference to pets.

September 20, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RozieToez

If the phrase's literal translation is incorrect, then why are you advocating for it?

As it stands, teaching American students the ná é sentence will be giving them incorrect information, because it does nothing to explicitly specify that it doesn't mean "than he does" which is what most American would mean when they said than him.

Duolingo resorts to informal mode constantly, so objecting to it doesn't make much sense.

But again: does Tá níos mó agam ná aige mean "I have more than he does"?

September 21, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PookaGar

A bit after the fact, and I don't want to get dragged into the debate, but I agree with airy3que that when I, as an AmEng speaker, see "I have more than him", my first interpretation of that sentence is also to read "him" as "[he does]". Following scilling's post, I gather this would be ná aige, but DL seems to be following the prescriptive standard on this question, for better or for worse, meaning that ná é should be used.

There is a lot of dialect inconsistency in the course, leading to ambiguities for some learners and not others, so if you think your answer should be accepted -- like so many of the other questions where Americanisms are accepted -- flag it as such. The distinction between the two is clearer in Irish, and prescriptive English, than in American.

November 19, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RozieToez

I'm talking very clearly about American informal usage. Not my personal usage.

And I'd like to learn how to translate into Irish "I have more than him" as it is most commonly understood to mean "I have more than he does". I'd like to do so in a way that conforms to Irish usage. Look, all prescriptivism aside, does Tá níos mó agam ná aige mean "I have more than he does" or doesn't it?

September 20, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/scilling

Why do you believe that I’m advocating that ná aige should be used for “than him”? “The phrase’s literal translation” refers to the “than him” phrase, which is the informal US English phrase that we’ve been discussing.

If you believe that the distinction between ná é and ná aige needs to be explicitly drawn for US students, then use the Report a Problem button to bring it to the attention of the course creators, since only they can do anything about the course’s content.

Again, please refer to my reply to Rewjeo above; the meaning is there.

September 21, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RozieToez

What I saw was Rewjeo asking a question and it not being answered. So, again: does Tá níos mó agam ná aige mean "I have more than he does"?

September 21, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/scilling

The question asked was “is it wrong to use aige rather than é” — the answer to that question is in the reply.

September 21, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RozieToez

I see an answer that limited itself to the fact that ná é and ná aige aren't interchangeable in Irish. But my question was about the entire sentence, not about elements within the sentence. So again: does Tá níos mó agam ná aige mean "I have more than he does"? Is the entire sentence constructed correctly? Are all the words where they should be and as they should be for the Irish sentence to mean "I have more than he does"?

September 21, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/scilling

The second sentence in that answer did not limit itself to their lack of interchangeability; it explains what each part would mean within the entire sentence. One can exchange ná é for ná aige in that sentence to replace the meaning of ná é with the meaning of ná aige, and the sentence with that replacement will still be correctly formed.

September 22, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mikeinkerry

There are many variants of English informal usage (as an English native I can assure you), so I expect there to be many US variants too. How does anyone know which one you refer to?

March 23, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DonaldAlas

How ridiculous. Is sgilling trying to tell us that aige is wrong because the English has than him rather than than he? Than he no longer exists in present-day English (in at least the majority of dialects). By far the most likely meaning of I have more than him is equal to I have more than he has.

March 29, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SatharnPHL
Mod
  • 1227

It's clear that the colloquial understanding of "I have more than him" in English is a source of confusion here. I don't know what the person who created the original Tá níos mó agam ná é intended, but from a strictly grammatical point of view, it doesn't mean "I have more than he does".

Personally, I would say Tá níos mó agam ná atá aige for "I have more than he has" (or "I have more than he does", which is equally acceptable in colloquial English but might also cause confusion for anyone trying to translate it too literally).

March 29, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/larryone

I tried "tá agam níos mó ná é". Failed.

May 11, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/scilling

Níos mó is the subject of the Irish sentence, so it needs to directly follow the verb; Irish word order is VSO (verb, subject, object).

September 20, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/danoconnell55

I can't seem to get the grammar. Does anyone have a suggested resource outside of duolingo for Irish grammar?

May 30, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Maggie81257

The more correct English phrase would be " I have more than he (the "has" being implicit). Therefore just wondering if the same would apply in Irish i.e. Tá níos mó agam ná aige?. Maybe not, just curious.

January 18, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KiwiPavlova

Tá níos mó agam ná mar atá aige - totally agree with Yvonne. The other version sounds as though I have more (people, slaves?!) than him - that he is one of my many possessions!

February 8, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shivaadh

Hmmm. Why do I need "mo" when I already have "agam"? Seems redundant.

January 26, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SatharnPHL
Mod
  • 1227

That's , not mo. The accents on a vowel are not just decorations.

níos mó means "more". It can also mean "bigger".

January 27, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shivaadh

"There is more big to me than to him." ("mo" means "big", not"me")

January 26, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pamhsiehca

Wow! An analytical group here! Would Ta nios mo agam na se make sense?

February 10, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SatharnPHL
Mod
  • 1227

No. is only ever used as the subject of a verb, and immediately adjacent to that verb.

February 10, 2019
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