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  5. "It is a dirty kitchen."

"It is a dirty kitchen."

Translation:Is cistin shalach í.

May 7, 2015



is shalach lenited because cistin is feminine? I don't recall seeing that before


Yes. Attributive adjectives agree with their nouns in case, number and gender, so shalach is lenited because cistin is feminine.


How come cistin isn't lenited also?


Why would cistin be lenited? - there isn't anything to cause lenition.

Feminine nouns in the nominative case are only lenited after the singular definite article an.

cistin - "(a) kitchen"
an chistin - "the kitchen"
na cistineacha - "the kitchens"


so all attributive adjectives modifying a feminine noun in the nominative case are lenited , even if the noun isn't?


I agree that it's really unsettling when noun and adjective don't do the same thing. It makes sense in Irish though, when you consider lenition as something different from gender/ number/ case. Lenition facilitated the flow of sound when certain letter combinations would have obstructed it (more info at nualeargais.ie under the chapter Initial Mutations). Seeing the cause as sound-related (ease of speech), rather than logic-related (grammatical function), helped me come to terms with the fact that an adjective can be lenited although its noun isn't.


??? The lenition of salach is logic-related in this case - it occrs solely because of the gender of the noun.


Why doesn't this sentence need the beginning reference pronoun as with "Is é namhaid phobail é"?


Because it doesn't contain a definite reference. Likewise, your sample sentence shouldn't include the first é.

If you wanted to say "It is the dirty kitchen", you could say:

Is í an chistin (chisteanach) shalach í. In this case, the first í is required for Munster and Connacht Irish, but not for Ulster.


Why is it í instead of é?


Because cistin is a feminine noun.


How do you tell feminine nouns from masculine nouns?


In most cases you just have to learn it. Most nouns ending in a slender consonant, like cistin, are feminine, but there are some exceptions, notably nouns that refer to male people (e.g. athair, deartháir); also nouns ending in the suffix -ín are always masculine (even cailín despite meaning 'girl').


Not all nouns ending in ín are masculine - bráillín, laichín, muirín, are just a few examples.

Many of the terms for jobs or occupations end in -eoir or -óir - those words are all masculine - dlíodóir, feirmeoir, uaireadóir, bádóir, isireoir, etc.

There is a guide that will help you get the gender of most nouns right here.


Why is salach lenited? Does the DeNTaLS DoTS rule not work here? Because cistín ends with N and salach begins with S, but salach is still lenited

[deactivated user]

    The DeNTaLS DoTS rule is not used with attributive adjectives.


    Cistin shalach is ea í was not accepted, but seems OK to me.


    I wrote Is salach í an chistin and Duo called it wrong. Is it?


    salach is an adjective, not a noun, so you wouldn't use it in that way to translate this sentence.


    Can it also be 'Tá cistin shalach'?


    No. You are classifying a pronoun ("it") as a noun ("kitchen"), so you use the copula Is, not the verb ().


    Cistin shalach atá sí should be OK, but was rejected. Reported.

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