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"This is a historic church, if you touch it we will have to make an explanation."

Translation:Burası tarihi bir kilise, ona dokunursan açıklama yapmak zorunda olacağız.

May 16, 2015

58 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/hannerfish

A quick shout out to Alex & the Turkish Duolingo team! You have taken the time to make this awesome comprehensive beginner course available to us for FREE, and when we thank you with endless questions and challenges, you answer us patiently and kindly. Thank you for everything you do!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/modene1

Why it is zorunda olacağız and not simply zorundayız ? I thought it might be to put it into the future, but wouldn't must make.. have the same meaning?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/hannerfish

If you do this lesson on a desktop, there is an explanation of zorunda that I found very helpful.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/revardssam

Bu bir tarihi kilisedir, eğer ona dokunursan biz bir açıklama yapmak zorunda olacağız


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Selcen_Ozturk

bir comes after the adjectives in Turkish


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/hannerfish

where is the adjective here?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Zesul

Can one say "yapmalıyız" instead of "yapmak zorunda olacağız"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Esh678

no, "yapmalıyız" means we have to make or must make, "yapmak zorunda olacağız" means we will have to make.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kbrady
  • 1690

Would "yapmalıyacağız" be acceptable?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/petermuster550

I just wanted to ask the same question.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/reza938204

Can you repeat this word again your self?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Aldrost

Is it not accepted? I'm wondering this too...

I've fallen this sentence so many times that I remembered its words exactly as they are :D


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/padm915118

That is the beauty of duolingo, you end up reviewing your mistakes till you learn it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/wickedbird

besides 'zorunda kalacagiz' "zorunda kaliriz" should also be considered correct


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jzlcdh

Can you clarify the meaning of this sentence please - perhaps with an example? I am sure the translation is wrong but I cannot give you the correct English without properly understanding what the Turkish means.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ektoraskan

Which part sounds wrong to you? It's just a weird sentence. If you had asked me to translate the Turkish sentence, the given English version would have been my way of wording as well. Perhaps I would put a fullstop after "church", but other than that, the sentence looks OK to me. Is it wrong?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jzlcdh

"make an explanation" is not in http://www.natcorp.ox.ac.uk/

Thanks for telling me the sentence is also weird in Turkish. I think it should be deleted as meaningless.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlexinNotTurkey

I have been speaking (American) English my entire life and I say "make an explanation" all of the time! Albeit, I learned a slightly more archaic dialect when I was young, but I am certain that it is normal in the English spoken in the US.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sainio

In that case, I take back my assertion that it's not something you'd say every day. =D

I'm sure there's a regional element, even within the US: I'm a New Englander, and if we make explanations here, it's usually because we were required to do so by the school principal or the judge. But I definitely don't consider it to be non-standard English, and it seems rather appropriate to the context. (If I were trying to impress on one of my kids the importance of not touching a historic something, I might very well warn him that he'd have to make an explanation.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlexinNotTurkey

Hahaha! I speak Standard American English with a bit of Boston splashed in (that is where I went to school and will be living next year). I grew up speaking Appalachian English though, which, as I said, is a little more archaic. Regardless, there are several other forms accepted besides make an explanation and I will probably change it as the best answer!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jzlcdh

Thanks for making that explanation. If you know a better US English corpus let me know. And more importantly if there is a Turkish corpus free on the web (I saw mention of a corpus but could not find a web interface for it) let us know.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlexinNotTurkey

I see what you did there and I like it :D


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RiaArik

"Make an explanation" is not standard English. Period.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/orde90

When I search for "make an explanation about" or "make an explanation" in Google I get hundreds of thousands results. If we cannot find a phrase in that corpus does it really mean that it's wrong?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ektoraskan

I did the same search. I think that none of those articles were written by native speakers of English. :/ On the first 5 pages, there are Turkish sites (Todayszaman, Hurriyet), Indonesian sites, one page of Yahoo answers, but it was about Norway, so it's likely that the author was Norwegian.

So I had to accept the fact that "make an explanation" isn't English. You learn something new every day!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sainio

You can "make an explanation" in English; it's just not something you'd say every day. (It sounds very official and vaguely threatening. =) ) It's more common to "give an explanation," and personally, I'd be much more likely to use "explain" as a verb: "if you touch it, we'll have to explain," or "if you touch it, we'll have to explain ourselves." (That might be pulling the translation a little too far from the Turkish sentence, though.)

The concept of an entire building that's too historic to touch seems a bit strange to me, but if the sentence were about a painting (for instance), instead of a church, it probably wouldn't strike me as particularly odd.

(Incidentally, when I Googled "make an explanation," the first result I got was the New Zealand Police, and the second was an Australian Facebook page about soccer, so I'm definitely not the only native speaker who thinks explanations can be made. =) )


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jzlcdh

I made a mistake. As Duolingo is American English and as I have never been to the USA I should have used an American English corpus such as http://corpus.byu.edu/coca/ Mind you that only gives 3 examples and all from the last century so perhaps it has gone out of use now. Your suggestion of ""We will have to do some explaining". is a good immediate fix but I reckon that in the long term more useful phrases and sentences should be added and the weird ones (except the amusing ones) deleted. I think your team was right to add them in order to get the course up and running, but I guess this beta stage is all about polishing it up and making it look good.

If the objective here is to give examples of "if" how about one of the following if they sound natural in Turkish: "If all the visitors touched that mosaic it would be damaged." "If all the visitors touched that mosaic it would be worn away." "Please do not touch the frescos: otherwise they will be worn away." "Please do not touch the wall paintings: a tiny touch from a thousand visitors and they will not be here for your grandchildren's children." Or perhaps there is some common real sign which can be used.

Incidentally in some very popular museums or historic sites in Britain there is a rock by the entrance which everyone is encouraged to touch as an example of touch damage: because so many people touch it you can soon see how it gets worn away.

And perhaps "tile" (fayans in Turkish?) might be a good word to add to the "Turkey" lesson when you get a chance.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/modene1

As far as I'm aware it doesn't exist in British English at all. It would be give. Alex has enlightened me about quite a few US/UK differences :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/modene1

Actually, I realised the real problem. Turk's tend to yapmak a lot of stuff, whereas we prefer verbs. So it would be "explain".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mischa820971

I agree with those arguing against "make an explanation." I'm a native American English speaker and I would never say that. "Provide an explanation" or "give an explanation" but never "make an explanation."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RedzB

"Bu bir tarihi kilise, eğer ona dokunursan bir açıklama yapmak zorunda olacağız" not accepted why?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Aldrost

Bir comes after the adjectives and before the noun, thus you have to use Bu tarihi bir kilise instead of bu bir tarihi kilise.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/saudekar

It works both ways in this case. He should report it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ali213331

no problem in this sentence. it is correct that you wrote. Report it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SavaManyas

Now this is some awful Turkish.

"yapmak zorunda kalacağız" / "yapmamız gerekecek" can be used. Comma was also used incorrectly in the Turkish sentence.

I don't think the person who translated this very knowledgeable in Turkish grammar and has a primitive misconception that "have to" must be translated as "zorunda olmak" regardless of the context.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mihailo71445

"We would have to give an explanation", correct it please.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mihailo71445

The actual meaning of the sentence would probably be not to touch the chruch because it's of historical value.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/evdeyoklar1

bu tarihi bir kilise, eğer ona dokunursan bir açıklama yapmak zorunda kalacağız da doğru olmalı. Burası tarihi bir kilise için this place is a historic church daha iyi bir çeviri bence.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Belph4

"Zorunda olmak" diye türkçe de bu kadar nadir kullanılan bir yapıyı doğru cevap olarak seçmeniz ve günlük kullanımda daha yaygın olan seçeneklerin hepsinde yanlış demesi çok sinir bozucu. Türkçe bu kadar esnek bir dilken doğru cevapları bu kadar sınırlamanız bütün devam etme isteğini öldürüyor. Doğru cevabı bulmaya çalışmaktan ziyade acaba bunu yazarken ne düşündüler diye düşünmek zorunda kalıyorum.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MargaretaS624701

Is this really Turkish for beginners?? The lessons are immediately jumping from easy learning sentences to very difficult, long and complicated sentences. Even my Turkish friends think it's weird.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NoraDereli

The sentences in the IF and DIK sections are terrible.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/balpers

This is perhaps the single worst sentence in a skill full of bad sentences. Learning the grammar in this skill is hard enough. Why not use verbs that we are familiar with already? And why sentences like this that barely make sense in English?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MargaretaS624701

I agree with you balpers


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Nightbird24

why is not tarihsel accepted here?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Zesul

Can I say, "...açıklama yapmamız gerekecek"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/saudekar

Yes, that was my answer, too. Not accepted though... Report it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/el_kousy

Açıklamamız gerek

Does this work


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Esh678

no, because "Açıklamamız gerek" means "we have to explain" not "we will have to make an explanation". maybe "açıklamamız gerekecek" would be a close translation. it means "we'll have to explain". but here in this sentence the exact translation of "making an explanation" is "açıklama yapmak" , while the verb "explaining" is "açıklamak". Maybe it doesn't make much of a difference in the meaning of the sentece, but they're not the same when you translate.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RiaArik

This sentence is grammatically incorrect, plus strange in English. I can correct the grammar, but not the bizarre way it comes across. "This is a historic church, if you touch it, we will need to explain."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mirage20

I whole-heartedly agree that this is a grammatically incorrect and strange sounding sentence in English. Actually it sounds quite weird in both languages. Aside from, "This is a historic church" (the only part of this sentence that makes sense) the rest is convoluted in both meaning and grammar.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RiaArik

I can fix the grammar, but it's still a strange sentence in English. How it should read: "This is a historic church, if you touch it, we will need to explain." (To "make an explanation" is absolutely incorrect English.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mirage20

"Bu tarihi bir kilisedir. Lütfen onu gezerken hiçbir şeye dokunmayın".

"This is a historic church. Please do not touch anything while touring it. "


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/padm915118

You have to explain, not make an explanation.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lbSTxG5i

Burası tarihi bir kilise, ona dokunursan bir açıklama yapmak zorunda olacağız is wrong. Why is bir açıklama incorrect?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NoraDereli

What an awful sentence.

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