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  5. "Чиї це студенти?"

"Чиї це студенти?"

Translation:Whose students are these?

May 22, 2015

22 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/marcoiris1

I have to say I find it counterproductive that whole sentences are often glossed. Understanding that Ukrainian grammar and English grammar are different is part of the learning process. I would prefer having individual word glosses, and then it being up to the learner to piece together the meaning of the sentence. "Чиї" - whose (pl), це (this/these) студенти (students). It feels like cheating to mouse over one word and be given the exact answer.

May 23, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN

I think it is because in this sentence "це" means "this" or "it" but becomes "these" because the sentence uses plural nouns. You are right though as they could have simply put "these" as an alternate meaning.

July 30, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/thraenthraen

Does це mean both "this" and "these" then? Is there ever a plural form? For example, is there a difference in how you'd translate "What is this?" and "What are these?" Or do you just have to rely on context to know if it's singular or plural?

May 22, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SergioRuido

ЦЕ is both for Singular and Plural. Just the form of the noun matters. Це студент. Це студенти.

May 22, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Vinnfred

However, "these students" should be translated as "Ці студенти".

If you know French, це= c'est, ce sont, цей = ce (ce chat), ця = cette, ці = ces

May 22, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/thraenthraen

I looked this up, and this source (scroll down to demonstrative pronouns for this/these) seems to agree with you, but 1) I'm not sure how great that source is since it has this/these in the second table when it probably means that/those, and 2) maybe there's something else going on?

May 22, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Vinnfred

You are right as to that/those
And I forgot to add that це can also mean this/ce for neuter gender: Це молоко (this milk).

May 22, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/shrikrishna1

If це is c'est , Ци would be ce son. N'est-ce pas?

February 1, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Vinnfred

We have only це: це - кіт (c'est un chat), це - коти (ce sont des chats)

February 8, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/shrikrishna1

Дякую, merci

February 8, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sagitta145

[noticing that you are learning German as well] "це" is like "das" in German. Works both for singular (das ist) and plural (das sind). You can say "Wessen Eltern sind das?", right? So we just skip the "sind" and only leave "das" which does not indicate plural or singular.

June 10, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/thraenthraen

Been awhile since I did any German, but that sounds like demonstratives in Dutch. Not sure about German, but in Dutch dat/dit (that/this) become die/deze for plurals depending on usage* ("this house"="dit huis" and "these houses"="deze huizen" but "this is a house"="dit is een huis" and "these are houses"="dit zijn huizen"). Is that (roughly) what's going on here with це/ці? "What is/are це?" but "Це student is..." and "Ці students are..."

*Gender also matters for which form is used in Dutch (and I believe German as well), but for the sake of simplicity I used a neuter word to avoid gender complicating the pattern.

June 12, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sagitta145

Yes, it's similar to the example that you wrote with houses.

When you are talking about "this" as kind of an adjective it will be цей-ця-це-ці.

When you are talking about "this" as not modifying a noun but being the subject of a sentence, it will be just це*.

Detailed examples (sorry, couldn't make it shorter):

  • Це does not carry a gender and does not indicate singular/plural (це = das = esto/este/ésta/estos).

[m] Це студент = This is a student = Das ist ein Student = Este es un estudiante.

[f] Це студентка = This is a student = Das ist eine Studentin = Ésta es una estudiante.

[pl] Це студенти = These are students = Das sind Studenten = Estos son estudiantes.

  • Цей-ця-це-ці carry a gender (цей = dieser = este, ця = diese = esta, ...)

[m] Цей студент = This student = Dieser Student = Este estudiante.

[f] Ця студентка = This student = Diese Studentin = Esta estudiante.

[pl] Ці студенти = These students = Diese Studenten = Estos/estas estudiantes.

The confusion might arise with neutre

[n] Це село can mean both "this is a village" (Das ist ein Dorf) and "this village" (Dieses Dorf). Basically imagine German "Das ist Dorf" and "Das Dorf", we drop "ist" so it becomes messy :)

Sorry, I can't do Dutch, so you try to guess by my German :) * potato for a long post *

June 12, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/thraenthraen

This is incredibly helpful, thanks! I can understand the German (and Spanish) just fine, just didn't want to butcher anything trying to write my own examples. :)

June 12, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sagitta145

Haha, no, I think you should try writing examples if you have some in mind, this is helpful for you to practice and understand how it works, and good for me to see how an "outsider" sees it :)

June 12, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DoDo107102

Чиї ці студенти would be the correct version, if I'm not mistaken.

February 20, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sagitta145

That would be "Whose are these students?"

January 12, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Pedro_Guz

chyyi tse studenty

November 14, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Klaudialk

I still don't really understand the difference between translating this (correctly) as "whose students are these?" and (incorrectly?) as "whose are these students?" and would appreciate some explanation :)

January 24, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sagitta145

Whose students are these? -> Чиї це студенти? (these/це is the subject)

Whose are these students? -> Чиї ці студенти? (students/студенти is the subject, these/ці is an attribute of the subject)

January 25, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sr.Cisne

A most unusual sentence in English.

March 16, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sagitta145

I assume you're not a student then :)

"Whose students are these? - Oh, these are the students of Prof. Somebody".

March 16, 2019
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