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- Topic: Norwegian (Bokmål) >
- "Jenta har på seg kjole."
40 Comments
Omitted. You could say "Jenta har på seg en kjole", but it's not as common. I think you should omit the article for all clothing when there isn't any adjectives. With an adjective it should always have an article: "Jenta har på seg en fin kjole".
Is it also like when we say "jeg er lærer"/ "jeg er leger"/etc? When telling our profession we also don't use the article before the substantive in Norwegian.
"Har på seg" literally translates to "has on his/her/their", so it would be like "the girl has on her dress" they use it as a phrase for "is wearing", though. I'm beginning to find a lot of phrases like this.
"Seg" is a reflexive pronoun, not a possessive, so the literal translation is "has on himself/herself/themselves", depending on the subject of the sentence.
2076
So in that formulation, it would be appropriate (in English) to use the article: "The girl has on herself a dress." But I understand languages are sometimes idiomatic.
I thought "sk", "sjk" and "kj" were pronounced the same, but the "kj" in kjole sounds softer than, say, the "skj" in skjorte. Is "kj" always supposed to sound like this. Also, why is sko pronounced "scoo" instead of "shoo"? What about the "sk" sound rule?
They definitely form three different sounds, albeit sounds that are difficult to distinguish between for many learners - and even a few natives in the case of 'skj-' vs. 'kj-'.
'kj-' is pronounced farther to the back of the mouth, with no discernible 's' sound at all, and is typically the one people struggle with getting right. The same goes for 'ky-', as in "kylling", and 'ki-', as in "kilde".
The good news is that if you can hear the difference, then you're already one step ahead. :)
As for the pronunciation of 'sk-', it's a bit trickier. In Old Norse, words beginning with an 'sk-' would always be pronounced the way they were written - without any 'j' sound sneaking in. In modern Norwegian it's not quite as simple:
'sk-' before 'i', 'y', and 'ei' is pronounced with a 'shj' sound.
'sk-' before 'a', 'e', 'o', 'u', 'å' is pronounced with a regular 'sk' sound.
'sk-' before 'øy' can't seem to make up its mind: "skøyter" with 'shj', "skøyer" with 'sk'
These are the general rules, but there are plenty of exceptions - particularly in the case of loan words. The word "skøyer" above is but one example, borrowed from Dutch.
it's easier to master for polish people since both sounds are present in polish language - "tj" sounds like "ś" and "sk" sounds like "sz"
just a note for people who are trying to harness polish pronunciation ;)
"Kj" is more like a strong H sound, right? Like the german "acht" (or at least something similar I guess). And "Skj" more of a "sh" sound, no?
The real struggle for me is saying the "Tj" sound in "Tjuefem" for example. It's such a weird sound! From what my bf explained, it should be a mix between the "kj" sound and the "skj" sound.. Drives me crazy XD
To make the "kj" sound your tongue must be almost flat behind your teeth in your lower jaw. If it is difficult, you could try holding the tongue down by putting a pencil on it until you get the hang of it.
- 227
Thanks for the clear explanation but what do you mean with skøyer borrowed from Dutch? I think you mean the term 'reisende'. Reisende is a normal Dutch word for someone or something that is traveling. Skøyer is not used in Dutch (we don't use the letter ø).
- 227
Ah okay, schooier is only really used for beggars though and has an even more negative sound to it then the more common 'zwerver'.
Is skøyer similar in that it's deemed insulting to use?
No, it has more light-hearted connotations in Norwegian. One might use it to describe someone who's joking around or playing tricks on people.
- 64
Ahh, it seemes to have sneaked into Finnish, too, as "koijari". I always wondered where that came from.
Don't know if you have figured out how to make the sounds or not but for me this is what i do. skj sounds like a softer "sh" so just do a regular "sh" in english but make it not so harsh. And then for kj, make a "sh" sound and notice how the tip of your tongue is pushed upward against your pallette (top of your mouth), move the tip of your tongue downward toward your bottom teeth and the middle of your tongue to the roof of your mouth, and with a relaxed mouth say "sh". Hope this helps
Ah, nevermind, I think I see it. "på seg" is "on herself". I assume that "The girl is wearing her dress" would be something like "Jenta har på seg kjole hennes" (or "hennes kjole"?). That would literally translate as "The girl has on herself her dress". Is this correct?
It would be either "Jenta har på seg kjolen hennes"(another girl's dress) or "Jenta har på seg kjolen sin"(her own dress).
- 2086
Maybe the dress is her grandma's dress. ;) The sentence does not describe who owns the clothing.
Insane! I am learning Norwegian not English none of them is not my native language! Other similar times an article is considered as mistake. I am really pissed off with this guessing!!!
I swear sometimes this app is drunk, if i wrote "a dress" i would've got it wrong, and because i did not write "a dress" and only "dress" i got it also wrong, i could swear it showed the same sentence without "a" smh
