"Fruktoj, legomoj kaj fromaĝo"

Translation:Fruit, vegetables and cheese

3 years ago

46 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/viktorbluhme

Ĉu vi estas franco? Francos ŝatas fruktojn, legomojn kaj fromaĝon.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/brasiko
brasiko
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Francoj* Vi pravas. Francoj tre ŝatas fromaĝon.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/viktorbluhme

-s marks the plural in so many European languages that breaking the habit is proving quite difficult..

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/vikungen

Indeed, that way it is even more refreshing once you do it.

The -oj plural ending derives from Classical Greek btw :)

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/amuzulo
amuzulo
Mod
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Interesting... even I didn't know that! Just curious, do you have a source for that? I'd like to read more about it. I knew kaj came from Greek. :)

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/grassator97

I can confirm a nominative plural ending for the masculine gender in ancient Greek is (Romanized) -oi, and feminine is -ai. -oi is pronounced the same way as the Esperanto -oj. So it very well could be!

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/seveer
seveer
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I believe this is simply a common prima facie assumption, e.g. from Wikipedia: "The Esperanto nominal–adjectival paradigm as a whole is taken from Greek: Esperanto nominative singular muzo (muse) vs. Greek mousa, nominative plural muzoj vs. Greek mousai, and accusative singular muzon vs. Greek mousan." These statements usually lack primary citation or are speculative. I have not seen any explication directly from writings of Zamenhof, but I also hope someone will direct me to one if it exists.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/FredCapp
FredCapp
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André Cherpillod Konciza Etimologia Vortaro Paĝo 207.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Svalfjor
Svalfjor
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We don't really know for sure, but it seems very plausible.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/AllanDaemon
AllanDaemon
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Not only Ancient Greek, but Latin (a close language) too. Eg. Campus (singular) and Campi (Plural). Of the Romanic languages, mainly Italian and Romanian derives the words from Latin using the nominative case, consequently using -i for plural.

Eg. in Italian child is Bambino (singular) and Bambini (plural). In Romanian the word priest is Preot (singular) and Preoți (plural)

In other cases (eg. French, Castelhano, Castilian, Catalan, Portuguese) they derive the words from another case (not sure which one now), that do the plurals with -s.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/med-ben
med-ben
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Good to know

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/FredCapp
FredCapp
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Ĝi estas tion kion mi provas meti en la manĝskatoloj de miaj filinoj, ĉiutage. Kaj ni ne estas franculoj.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ChuckWalter

The three major food groups...

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/mW4227

They all count toward your 5-a-day!

1 month ago

https://www.duolingo.com/real1adam

How does Esperanto deal with the Oxford comma (a comma to end a list)?

(e.g. Fruktoj, legomoj kaj fromaĝo v.s. Frukoj, legomoj, kaj fromaĝo)

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/vikungen

It varies, there isn't really a standard afaik.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/RomajiAmulo

So, is it valid?

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/vikungen

Yes.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/VincentOostelbos
VincentOostelbos
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That said, I think it is quite common to leave it out. Esperanto tends to base itself for many such rules more on (other) European languages than on English, and many such languages do not have the Oxford comma. I always use it for English, but never for my native Dutch, for example (where it is considered wrong). I probably wouldn't use it for Esperanto either. But it wouldn't bother me if someone else did.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/zagadka314

This comma is so nice, it is sad that other languages don't use it :(

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/VincentOostelbos
VincentOostelbos
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To me, Dutch looks equally nice without it as English does with it (and Dutch equally weird with it as English without it). But I can understand people who have stronger opinions about it one way or the other, for every language.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/potatoking42
potatoking42
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Was about to ask the same thing, this has been bothering me

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/-Zorua-
-Zorua-
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Sounds bongustan.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/alytheg

I keep wanting to write "veggies" instead of vegetables every time

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/JackBond
JackBond
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Legomo sounds like it's based on the root for "legume". But vegetables aren't all legumes are they?

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ungewitig_Wiht

In French legume means vegetable. In English legume was borrowed from French and came to refer to a specific subset.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/FredCapp
FredCapp
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Specifically beans and pod vegetables

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/fizzy224385

It seems that Spanish legumbre has both meanings. SpanishDict says that in cooking, it means legumes as in English ("Los vegetarianos consumen muchas legumbres, como frijoles o lentejas, porque tienen mucha proteína" = Vegetarians consume lots of legumes, like beans and lentils, because they have a lot of protein), but in botany, it could mean either ("Pedro cultiva legumbres en su jardín para alimentar a sus conejos" = Pedro grows vegetables in his garden to feed his rabbits). I could be wrong, though, because I'm not a native Spanish speaker.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Felipe382844

Wich legume are you talking about? I speak portuguese, and it's not on my language. In portuguese, "legume" is a vegetable that contains a "leguminosa". I believe that other languages "legumej" are the same thing.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/etieffen
etieffen
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=> Om nom nom nom nom nom nom...

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PeterusAgustus

I think people who think esperanto is like Spanish are mistaken. It derives more from French and Italian.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/billleverett

Why is the 'j' ending only on fruit and veg. Why not 'fromagoj'?

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/JackBond
JackBond
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Because they're saying "cheese", not "cheeses"

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/billleverett

Okay, here's a follow-up question. Where do you draw the line between 'frukto' and 'fruktoj'? Is a bunch of grapes fruktoj, or does it have to be different kinds of fruit? Is more than one pea legomoj? If I cut a wedge of cheese into bite-size slices, would that be fromagoj?

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/FredCapp
FredCapp
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A lot of this is a particularly Anglo-centric way of looking at various foodstuffs. Fruit and fruits can both mean the same thing. "I have a bowl of fruit." can mean that I have a bowl that's full of apples, and only apples. or it can mean that I have a bowl full of mixed fruit. (see what i did there?) Esperanto says "more than one kind? Plural" Veggies are usually perceived as plural, even if you only have a bit of spinach on your plate. Esperanto says "Only one kind? I think that's singular, but…"

Cheese is usually also treated by number of types. If your pile of fruits and veggies has a bit of muenster, but only muenster, with it, it doesn't look at the number of chunks of muenster it looks at the fact that there is only one discernible type of cheese on your sabhzi, or party tray.

For this to be fromaĝoj then one would need to toss some Camembert, Wensleydale, or brie onto the tray also. (Maybe while someone is playing bouzouki in the corner?)

(For the nedenaskaj anglo-parolantoj that last is yet another Monty Python reference. Google: "Monty Python Cheese Shop")

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/FredCapp
FredCapp
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Bonvenon al Kalifornio!!

Redakto: Mi pardonpetas, la listo mankas flokojn kaj nuksojn.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/NoelEtrof
NoelEtrof
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What would dairy (the food group) be in esperanto?

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/FredCapp
FredCapp
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Laktaĵolaktoprodukto. Se vi parolas pri ovojn vi diras ovaĵo, ktp.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/KeliOl
KeliOl
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Duo suggests Fruktoj = fruit ... -j is a plural form, so... i don't understood it

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/FredCapp
FredCapp
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Fruit, in English, is a sort of "mass" or "irregular noun." When one is discussing plural fruits one may lump them all into a singular class. So a pot full of grapes, apples, pears, bananas and peaches can still be called "a bowl of fruit," while at the same time a container bearing only apples can still be "a bowl of fruit." The English usage of "fruits" is something which I, a native English speaker, cannot discern the exact rules for.

I know, sounds kinda fruity.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/JackBond
JackBond
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I would almost say "fruits" is used only if you want to explicitly describe multiple types of fruit. Whereas "fruit" alone could be one type or many types.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/FredCapp
FredCapp
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That's one. Why am I sure that there are others?

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/KeliOl
KeliOl
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thanks !

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/KeliOl
KeliOl
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thanks !!

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/trielt
trielt
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To die for.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/khaakenajaf

I write legumes but it was incorrect. Why?

11 months ago
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