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"Bonvolu ŝuti iom da sukero en mian kafon."

Translation:Please pour some sugar into my coffee.

May 29, 2015

43 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Migranto

Def Leppard would answer this "ŝutu iom da sukero sur min".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/grassator97

Ah, I came to the comments to say this.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Majklo_Blic

And I came to the comments to read it.


[deactivated user]

    en la nomo de amoo..


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ichbinjras

    Why is not correct "Bonvolu ŝuti iom da sukero en mia kafo."?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lingvulo

    That's a grammatical sentence, but means something else. Whenever you have the preposition en, you need to make the noun phrase after it accusative if you want the 'into' meaning.

    Bonvolu ŝuti iom da sukero en mia kafo. = 'Please pour some sugar (while you're) in my coffee.' (Not specified what you'll be pouring the sugar into.)

    Bonvolu ŝuti iom da sukero en mian kafon. = 'Please pour some sugar into my coffee.'

    Of course, the en mia kafo version describes an extremely implausible request. Here's a pair where both meanings are very plausible:

    La infanoj kuras en la domo. = 'The kids run (and they are) in the house.' (They're in the house the whole time they're running; they don't come in from outside.)

    La infanoj kuras en la domon. = 'The kids run into the house.'


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ichbinjras

    Dankon pro via respondo. So I can assume that something similar happens with:

    Li saltas sur la tablo (He jumps on the table)

    Li saltas sur la tablon (He jumps onto the table)

    Am I correct?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lingvulo

    Jes, vi tute pravas.


    [deactivated user]

      So, La infanoj kuras al la domo means in the direction of the house?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/aleksescomu

      jes, kaj eble ili eĉ eniros en la domon


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/aleksescomu

      If you remove a preposition, you add an "n": ŝuti sukeron al en la kafo

      "al en" estas ĝusta sed ne ofta nek bela, tial oni forigas "al" kaj aldonas non: ŝuti sukeron en la kafon


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SariniLynn

      I never thought of it that way... Thank you!


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ISpeakAlien

      Cxu "al en" vere estas gxusta? Mi ne sciis tion...


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ThaleZOliver

      What's the difference between the verbs: VERSXI x SXUTI


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KateVinee

      "Verŝi" is for liquids, and "ŝuti" is for non-liquids. (For an easy mnemonic, I remember that one verŝas vinon but ŝutas sukeron.)


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Luis_Domingos

      Could you use "ŝutu" here?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lingvulo

      The verb after "bonvolu" has to be in the infinitive form. See my comment on a similar question here: https://www.duolingo.com/comment/8842728


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Luis_Domingos

      Dankon pro via respondo!


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/aleksescomu

      bonvolu ŝuti = ŝutu bonvole iom... > bonvole ŝutu iom da sukero en mian kafon > bonvolu, ŝutu...


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AjxojLerni

      are you ranking them by politeness or grammatical correctness?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/aleksescomu

      All are as polite and grammatical correct as "bonvolu ŝuti..." which is the most frequent.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/traevoli

      If you wanted to use the imperative (command-form) of ŝuti -- and you still wanted to be polite about it -- you would have to change the word for "please" to an adverb. So you could say "Bonvole ŝutu iom da sukero..." This is a less common form but you do come across it.


      [deactivated user]

        You would have to change "Bonvolu" to "Bonvole". "Bonvole ŝutu iom da sukero en mian kafon" would be OK. You can't have two imperatives in the same sentence, except in a sentence telling someone two do more than one thing, such as, "Go to your room and tidy it!".


        [deactivated user]

          Although word-for-word, the English translation is correct, we don't usually use "pour" for small amounts. We'd say "Please put some sugar into my coffee." I think this is one of those instances where it is better to translate the meaning, rather than the individual words, but I must admit I have not tried using "put" here.


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/qoppaphi

          Bonvolu ŝuti ĈIOM da sukero en mian kafon.


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Snugglesworth

          So, don't use -n after prepositions, except when you do? Sounds an awful lot like an exception in the no exceptions language. :) But seriously, it's a bit confusing. Why not keep -n for accusative and use something else for showing movement?


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DJvdZ

          Because there are many natural languages that use an accusative for direction (e.g. latin, Hebrew, German) Using an other letter only for ditection would have been an option and it might even have been easier for you and maybe for other native English speakers and people who are only familiar with languages that do not have a accusative of direction, and especially for native speakers of a language that has a special case to expres movement in a direction (e.g. Finnish, Hungarian and Estonian have some locative cases for different movements: an illative case just for movement into something, an elative for movement out of something, an allative for movement 'onto' and an ablative for mivement away from something), but is would have been an extra hurdle for people with another linguistic background. Keep in mind that esperanto in some way is always a compromise. And speaking for myself I am glad esperanto only has two cases.


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Emile_Bouwer

          Yes, yes - that's very nice but having to memorize haphazard exceptions is difficult and confusing to all people, regardless of your linguistic/ethnic background.


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Raztastic

          Esperanto is only haphazard in the sense that all grammatical and morphological rules are haphazard in all languages. Even with the accusative of spacial/temporal movement, this remains one of the easiest-to-learn languages in the world.


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vytah

          It's a calque from all the languages that use preposition+not-accusative for location and preposition+accusative for direction. Those languages include German, Latin, Russian and most other Slavic languages.


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/aleksescomu

          -N has two meanings: accusative and marker of deleted preposition (the course creator should have said "don't use the accusative -n after prepositions" but that would be too confusing for beginners, i think)

          If you remove a preposition, you add an "n": -ŝuti sukeron al en la kafo (=sukeron en la kafon)

          -en lundo mi naĝos (=lundon mi naĝos) (=monday i'll swim)

          -mi iras al londono (mi iras londonon)


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MailmanSpy

          The section notes explain why this is, but in case you haven't read them, here they are:

          THE DIRECTIONAL -N

          In addition to its use for the direct object, the -n ending is also used to show direction:

          Ŝi saltas sur la tablo. = She jumps (up and down) on the table. Ŝi saltas sur la tablon. = She jumps onto the table (from another location).


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/XamLeumas

          Apparently, "ŝuti" comes from the German word "schütten".


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kkvlk

          Shouldn't "Please add some sugar ..." be accepted? After all in english, you don't pour sugar into the cup, you add it, or throw it inside.


          [deactivated user]

            I think "Please put some sugar in my coffee" would be the most natural English expression, but I haven't tried it here, so I don't know if it would be accepted.


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Davgwynne

            I did. It was.


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ja52ng74

            Bona kafo ne bezonas sukeron


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Emile_Bouwer

            Woe is me! I suppose it I was asking for too much when I hoped that Esperanto wouldn't do exactly what distresses me most about English: Using one suffix for three different meanings. Just as English adds an S (or 'S - there is no difference in sound) to the end of words to imply either 1)possession (with exceptions) 2)plural (with exceptions) or 3)contracted "is"; Esperanto now uses the N suffix for 1)direct object (with exceptions) 2)directional movement and 3)replace prepositions. Sigh... I can cut my disappointment with a knife...


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Davgwynne

            That’s not all: https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/9650731/When-to-use-the-n-ending

            I also had hoped for a perfect language, with entirely regular everything. However, it is less messy than English and usually (but not always) it is more logical.


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MarkWootton

            Esperantistoj amas kafon, ĉu ne?

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