"Nia hundo ne estas pura; ĝi estas malpura."

Translation:Our dog is not clean; it is dirty.

3 years ago

20 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/thraenthraen
thraenthraen
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Is it normal in Esperanto to refer to a pet as ĝi? I'd think li or ŝi would be more normal, at least if it's your own dog and you (presumably) know the sex, but that could just be my native English influencing me.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/vikungen

Maybe it would be more normal in English, but this is not English and ĝi is used commonly both for pets and for persons which gender is not known.

Edit: And babies.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/VincentOostelbos
VincentOostelbos
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Interesting :)

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/arbaro
arbaro
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I think that the official rule is that you're supposed to use "ĝi" but in practice everyone just kind of does whatever their native language does

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/VincentOostelbos
VincentOostelbos
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I will use li or ŝi. I use he and she in English as well, where you're not "supposed" to, just to make a statement I guess.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/garpet
garpet
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When I learnt English at school I was taught that "it" was used when we refer to animals and objects.

Although, my teacher noted that the latter tendencies show that pets are referred as "he" or "she". The reasons are simple: in the last century animals became pets and were rather members of the family than livestock, besides many movements such as "rights for the animals" and organisations like "save the endangered species" started working. As Esperanto was not used as much as English it managed to preserve it's original 1887 form (okay there were some changes as well).

It's a philosophical problem whether we should refer to animals as he/she/li/ŝi or as it/ĝi. However see the other side of this problem: My mother toe (Hungarian) doesn't make any difference between he or she (we only have one word for a third person/animal: "ő") and if we want to refer an object we use "that" (in Hungarian: "az"). For me it seems quite impractical (and even a bit sexist if you get this wee irony) to have a different word for both sexes. It's much easier and also helpful to avoid awkward situations. From this point of view it's quite useful to have a word which can be used to refer to things (from persons and animals up to lifeless objects). If we didn't use "ĝi" to refer those living beings whose sex we don't know, then it would reduce the use of it as we'd only use it when we refer to objects.

The question here is that should we change this logical and useful yet a bit fundamental way of referring in the name of political correctness?

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/filopodia_
filopodia_
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A couple of my friends use they/them pronouns and other gender neutral pronouns, could gxi in Esperanto convey this, or would it be like 'it' to English speakers? Is there a gender neutral pronouns in Esperanto?

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/VincentOostelbos
VincentOostelbos
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To answer your last question, the pronoun "ri" is discussed among some speakers. Not everybody likes it, but it seems fine to me. See the excessive discussion here (a lot of other stuff there, too, but you can Control+F (or whatever your OS/browser's equivalent for searching on a page) for "ri " with a space and you'll find it quite quickly).

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/filopodia_
filopodia_
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Thank you so much!!

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/VincentOostelbos
VincentOostelbos
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Nedankinde :)

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/cwetherbae
cwetherbae
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A better gender-neutral pronoun (in my opinion) is sxli, which is basically a combination of sxi and li. I see no reason for ri, and I wouldn't know what you were saying if you used it.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/filopodia_
filopodia_
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I understand your point, but one criticism of creating a mesh of two already existing pronouns is that, by doing so, the gender binary is actually enforced. For example, the English (s)he combination does not account for those people that use they/them pronouns, or other gender neutral pronouns, but rather only for the people that use she/her pronouns or he/him pronouns. I feel like sxli would run into similar problems.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/AiSENMA
AiSENMA
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Does "pura" refer here to clean in the sense of "without dirt", or could it refer to the fact that the dog is mixed race, i.e., not a pure breed?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/michfuchs
michfuchs
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I can well accept that it's ĝi in Esperanto. But the English translation should definitely accept he/she.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/AANickFan

Semicolons are useless, in my opinion. It can easily be replaced by a "." (I don't know what it's called, sorry, English isn't my first language).

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/VincentOostelbos
VincentOostelbos
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Well, they are a way to indicate a closer relationship between two sentences (often times in terms of an explanation or a causal link) than a normal period (that's what you call it) would. However, you can do something similar with words like "That's because" or "For example" or whatever, if you prefer. It's not right or wrong; each may have their own preference :)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Davgwynne

“.” is called a “period” in American or a “full stop” in English.

3 weeks ago

https://www.duolingo.com/DeanG20
DeanG20
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Referring to a dog as "it" is so rude

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/AANickFan

No. Esperanto isn't referring to a dog as "it", Esperanto is referring to a dog as "ĝi".

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/bir_kedi
bir_kedi
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i'm not surprised. it's a DOG after all...

2 months ago
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