"Ce sont les robes auxquelles je pense."

Translation:These are the dresses I am thinking of.

December 27, 2012

62 Comments
This discussion is locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/VancouverBrad

This one's tricky as the phrase "These are the dresses I am thinking of." isn't too common in English. I think "These are the dresses I was thinking of." is more common, but the present tense "je pense" seems quite specific.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sitesurf

It may be debatable whether you are still thinking of these dresses at the time you mention it...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/hwakely

It's just how it's said in English whether you're still thinking about them or not.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JuliaHolli7

I'd say, if you are talking about them, you'd have to be thinking about them.


[deactivated user]

    I am pretty sure that penser here means more than just thinking, such as considering, as in considering buying or wearing or cleaning etc.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jessica535332

    In English, the past tense has more uses than just talking about the past.

    Here the past tense is being used for politeness, but it can also be used to speak about the present and future in conditions.

    https://learnenglish.britishcouncil.org/en/english-grammar/verbs/past-tense

    As a native speaker "These are the dresses I was thinking of." clearly means you're still thinking of the dresses.

    It's not 'debatable', it's merely the polite form. If you want to talk about things that happened in the past here, you need to use past perfect: "These are the dresses I have thought about".


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/--Roody--

    In a sense, the past tense here is a form of the English conditional tense or voice?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BrandiSiek

    I think it can be present tense. Like "These are the dresses I am thinking of taking on my honeymoon". It accepted my translation of "thinking about" instead of "thinking of". So that could be "These are the dresses I am thinking about returning to the store" or something like that.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sitesurf

    you are right, but it French, you would need to change the construction:

    • ce sont les robes que je pense emporter en voyage de noces

    • ce sont les robes que je pense retourner au magasin.

    so you see, "auxquelles" has disappeared, replaced by "que", which has become the object of verbs emporter/retourner and not anymore indirect objects of verb "penser à"


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/augyip

    Does it mean that it is wrong to say "ce sont les robes que je pense"?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sitesurf

    Yes, "penser à" is not directly transitive.

    You don't "think dresses" either but "of/about dresses"


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/desrain

    I am struggling with this lesson! duo is giving me a hard time! So I must say, that it is improper English to end a sentence with a preposition.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BarbaraSti2

    The grammatically correct answer on English ends with.." of which i am thinking". One should never end a sentence with a preposition.. (of)


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mike904263

    Correct grammar dictates that this should be 'these are the dresses of which I am thinking. As Churchill once wrote 'ending a sentence with a preposition is something up with which I shall not put'.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BarbaraSti2

    Yes, and duo often marks me incorrect for using very proper English


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GraemeSarg

    Yes, but Churchill said it because he was mocking the people who claimed that it was not correct!!!


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/King9985

    Yeah, I swear that the quote was something more like, 'Criticising people who end sentences with prepositions...' I don't know, but I'm pretty sure. Honestly, though, I don't agree because I always avoid putting them there myself.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AmirKaramu

    Why isn't this "CES" sont instead of "CE" sont? Don't we have to conjugate the Ce as usual?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sitesurf

    "c'est" and "ce sont" are fixed formulas where "ce" remains invariable (comparable to there is/there are)


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dmachado

    What is the difference between "lesquelles" and "auxquelles?"


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ninethousand

    Auquel/auquelle/auxquels/auxquelles adds a meaning of "to which" (or "of which", in this case). Lequel/laquelle/lesquels/lesquelles is just "which" without that additional charge.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ktinparis

    Merci beaucoup pour cette réponse....j'ai eu besoin de ça!


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/stupefaite

    à + laquelle = à laquelle (not *auquelle)


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Bill493693

    the answer is grammatically incorrect...in English, one does not end a sentence in a preposition


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RaphaeI

    uh, in english, 'that' and 'which' should be interchangeable...


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/olitwin

    Not so, strictly speaking. Though almost no one distinguishes between them any more, formally you say "that" to specify the one thing out of several you mean, e.g.: "The horse that is black [instead of the horse that is white]". You would say "which" to describe further something already identified, e.g.: "The dog, which is barking at the squirrel".

    That said, for Duolingo's purposes I doubt they should be picky.

    /pedantic


    [deactivated user]

      Brilliant, thank you, now I understand my native English better :-)


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/saunarie

      I might translate this sentence more poetica lly " These are the dresses I dream about"


      [deactivated user]

        Strictly speaking, that is a run-on sentence without the word that.


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ldn_Field

        So, would it be correct to say that "auxquelles" is the equivalent of "dont" for inanimate objects?


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sitesurf

        not exactly:

        dont = de+le-quel / de qui

        auquel = à+le-quel / à qui


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mangonebula

        Why does auxquelle translate to "of whom" in this case, but in the cases of "auxquelle il parle" it translates to "to whom?" Is there a rule for this? very confusing.


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sitesurf

        think of/about = penser à => auxquelles (= à+les+quelles)

        talk to = parler à => auxquelles


        [deactivated user]

          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/misosss

          Shouldn't the french sentence be "Ces sont ..." instead of "Ce sont..."? According to http://french.about.com/od/grammar/a/adjectives_demonstrative.htm I should be right. What's your opinion?


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sitesurf

          No, "ce sont" is a fixed phrase, with pronoun "ce" invariable.


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lumna

          This is just my opinion . I find this part rather hard and I have the feeling that maybe it is not properly graduated for beginners . I daresay too many things all together. In Italy we say "Mettere troppa carne sulla brace" ( put to much meat on the barbecue = it will not be well done). I know that you are working hard and thank you for your useful help. :-)


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sitesurf

          In French: Ne chargez pas trop la mule (do not load the mule too much)


          [deactivated user]

            Too, not to :-)


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sygmoral

            It is the dresses that I am thinking about.

            If that is not a potential correct translation, how would that be in French? I interpreted this as if the person was not actually seeing the dresses, but is only thinking about them. Someone asks them whether they're thinking about the shoes, and they reply: [No], it's the dresses I'm thinking about.


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GraemeSarg

            In my opinion, you need something more robust than a pronoun to achieve the plural to singular conversion, otherwise it just looks like a grammatical error, in either language.

            Perhaps something along the lines of: "Les robes sont le sujet/cas/truc auquel je pense."

            "C'est les robes auquel je pense." says the same thing, but it looks like a grammatical error even though the Object of penser à is singular.

            In context, and with the addition of the word "No,", you can just about get away with using "it" in English, but you would have to ask a French native whether it works in French.


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Yarouge

            Why can't I say "ceS"? We ar talking about several dresses...

            Also, couldn't it be "j'y pense"?


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sitesurf

            "ces" is only a plural demonstrative adjective, to be used in front of a noun: ces robes = these dresses

            in front of verb "être", you need invariable pronoun "ce" in singular as in plural: c'est / ce sont


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Yarouge

            Also, can "c'est" also mean "celle est"?


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sitesurf

            Not really. C'est can be this is or that is (+ he is / she is, in front of a modified noun)

            "This one" is or "that one" is can translate to "celle-ci est" or "celle-là est" if the object is feminine.


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LeeBrownst1

            Should there be a liaison between "robes" and "auxquelles"? I didn't hear any in the audio.


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sitesurf

            No liaison between "robes" and "auxquelles".


            [deactivated user]

              I do not understand why "to whom I think" is refused.


              https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sitesurf

              Penser à = To think of/about (not "to").


              https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CSA_GW
              • 1926

              I wonder about the liaison between "roBeS auxquelles". "S" is not pronounced?


              https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sitesurf

              It is not and it should not.


              https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Peter435682

              Pourquoi pas "these are the dresses I think about?"


              https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GraemeSarg

              The simple present tense is valid grammatically, but it strikes me as a fairly unlikely context, to be thinking of them repeatedly or habitually.


              https://www.duolingo.com/profile/shlomiabr

              Why "auxquelles" and not "dont"? Merci


              https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BarbaraSti2

              You Penser à something, not penser de. So auxquelles, lequel, etc and not dont.


              [deactivated user]

                "Dont" remplace un complément introduit par "de". "Auxquelles" remplace un complément introduit par "à". "C'est DE cette robe que je parle" -> "C'est la robe DONT je parle". "C'est À cette robe que je pense" -> "C'est la robe À LAQUELLE je pense".


                https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BrianC512805

                Covering up my reply with their correction is NOT CLEVER


                https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jerryjsl27

                Why not "these are the dresses of which i was thinking"


                https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sitesurf

                It does not work because "I was thinking" is in the past continuous tense and "je pense" is in the present tense.


                https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Charis_Anna

                To be proper English, it should be "these are the dresses of which I am thinking". Never end a sentence with a preposition! Colloquially people do, but it sounds odd

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