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  5. "You do not know what to say."

"You do not know what to say."

Translation:Vi ne scias kion diri.

June 11, 2015

47 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlphaBetaGamma96

What's the difference between "scias" and "konas" ??? Is it similar to German, where you have Weiß (to know factually) or Kenne ( to know of something or someone)??? Dankon


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
  • 2409

Yes. It's taken more directly from French (savoir/connaître) and Spanish (saber/conocer).

(Although "scii" probably comes more directly from Latin, since that's the root of "science".)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/henmcb

You're right; scii does come from the Latin word scīre. Although koni doesn't; the Latin equivalent is nōvisse.

Edit: I was wrong; koni and its romance language cognates come from Latin cognōscere: to understand.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
  • 2409

Whence "cognition". :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/henmcb

Exactly! But it is sciado in Esperanto, using the scii side, rather than koni.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
  • 2409

No argument there.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Fantomius

Duolingo rejected my answer of:

Vi ne scias tion, kion diri.

I'll admit it's more wordy than "Vi ne scias kion diri", but isn't it still correct?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FredCapp

Per what I learned 20 years ago, it is.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Fantomius

Thanks! I did report it, so hopefully it will be allowed soon.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FredCapp

Bonan ŝancon, mi raportis ĝin antaŭ unu jaro.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Fantomius

Mi ĵus ricevis ret-mesaĝon ke Duolingo nun akceptas tiun ĉi frazon ("Vi ne scias tion, kion diri") kiel traduko de "You do not know what to say."

Bonege!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FredCapp

<Kermit > YAYYYY!</Kermit>


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Germodeltoro

"Kion vi ne scias diri" can also be correct, yes?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mutusen

No, I would interpret it as "What don't you know to say?" You cannot separate "kion" and "diri", they form a separate clause.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Germodeltoro

That's assuming if I added a question mark at the end. Rather, this is a statement. It's the difference between "Kion vi ne scias diri." and "Kion vi ne scias diri?" I assumed the word order doesn't matter as the n- suffix is the key indicating it is the object of not knowing, rather than the structure of the sentence.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/marcusaureliusf

Despite the -n ending, word order does matter in Esperanto in many situations: Kion vi ne scias diri? = What don't you know [how] to say? [Tio,] Kion vi ne scias diri = That thing you don't know [how] to say. Diri kion vi ne scias = [To] say what you don't know. Ne vi diri kion scias = ?????


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mutusen

It sounds like a question anyway, even without a question mark. "Kion" is the object of "diri", and the object of "scias" is the entire clause "kion diri".

Maybe it is clearer if we translate it as "Vi ne scias tion, kion diri". This "tion" is here to introduce the subclause, but you can usually leave it out.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Iggyzeppelin

how would you add a question mark in speech?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/salivanto

Not really. "Ĉu" is only for yes/no type questions, not for the type of questions under discussion here.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/salivanto

Tone of voice. Context. Facial expressions. Body language.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/noureddin95

I reported "Vi ne scias tion, kion vi volas diri." I believe that it's correct.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FredCapp

I believe you are right.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Smalde

"You don't know that, what you want to say" is not exactly the same as "You don't know what to say". "What to say" is in my understanding "what you ought to say" while "what you want to say" is just what you want to say. In my opinion, this two do not match exactly.


[deactivated user]

    This construction makes less sense in English than it does in Esperanto, but it's generally accepted that "tio(n), kio(n)" means the same thing as simply "kio(n)" in this context. The sentences you provide above have the same meaning; one just sounds more natural in English because we don't have this construction. "ti-, ki-" constructions are very common in Esperanto. I've had it explained to me that using simply "kio(n)" is actually an abbreviation for the full "tio(n), kio(n)," although I'm not sure how true that is.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FredCapp

    Even in some forms of English one can find the construct: … that, which…


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/noureddin95

    Ok, I am sorry. I meant "Vi ne scias tion, kion vi diru".

    I asked about this in "Lernu!" forums. Maybe both are equally correct.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MattSevits

    I'm really struggling with how to pronounce "scii" and its various forms. Can someone help me out? Do the "s" and "c" have to be prnounced individually? Because it seems like the "s" + "ts" sounds seem like they would just slur together into an elongated "s" sound?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FredCapp

    This one gave me trouble back in the beginning too. What worked for me was thinking of the word "sits" then leaving out the 'i'. This helped me to set into my head the fact that there are two sounds.

    Scii is not the only place you will find this combination; scienco, sceno, sceptero & sciuro (science, scene, scepter, & squirrel) all come to mind & the combination also shows up in the middle or end of other words, so hammering away at this is needed.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MattSevits

    Thanks! I'll be sure to practice.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FredCapp

    I'm now imagining you wandering around your office going "S-ts" "s-ts" all day long. ;D


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/OsiatSimbe

    Wow, thanks to you I can now pronounce that damn "sc-"! Thank you! :p


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FredCapp

    Bonvenon

    redakto: Sed oni neniam donis al mi lingoton. ;(


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PatriciaJH

    Sed nun mi donas al vi lingotojn! Havu lingotojn!


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/salivanto

    For those who have trouble pronouncing "scias", here's a video I made which hopefully will help. (It's my most popular video on YouTube.)

    Kiel prononci scias

    https://youtu.be/00NgauuAyeI


    [deactivated user]

      I accidentally put 'ke' instead of 'kion'. Native Spanish leaking through


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/philipposb

      What is wrong with:"Vi ne scias diri kion?"


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/salivanto

      People don't say it like this. I suspect the reason is that this is essentially a contraction of the following sentence:

      • Vi ne scias tion, kion diri.

      Your sentence could easily be understood as "You don't know to say what?" (What is it that you don't know how to say?)


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FredCapp

      Maybe Duo's database. Report it..


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FredCapp

      Is that why there are so many comments here?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tacit-blue

      why is it kion and not just kio? I feel like the answer is probably something really obvious but I just can't tell what it is :\


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
      • 2409

      Because it's the direct object of "diri". It works the same in English, only we don't usually mark for subject/object other than pronouns.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/real1adam

      638 days?? 8 languages? Wow!


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Baloug

      Can there be a comma between scias and kion?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FredCapp

      There can be a comma anyplace, but that's one I'd think hard about.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Haytham172317

      Why "kio + n" if diri isn't a noun or refers to a person?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
      • 2409

      "Diri" is the verb "to say/to speak". "Kion" is the direct object of that verb.

      https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/9055532?comment_id=24509781

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