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  5. "Yaşlı kadın içeriyi görüyor."

"Yaşlı kadın içeriyi görüyor."

Translation:The old woman sees inside.

June 13, 2015

53 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lisa4duolingo

Good question. This is how I understand why içeriyi is used instead of içinde. In this sentence, içeriyi is serving as a noun and is the direct object of "görüyor" (to see). Therefore, it is in the accusative case -- içeri + i (plus the buffer "y") = içeriyi. It's a bit strange to me because in English "inside" in a sentence constructed like this would simply be an adverb. I wonder if "Yaşlı kadın içeri görüyor," wouldn't also be an acceptable translation of "The old woman sees inside."

I am also reminded of a couple of other sentences in this lesson:

"İçeriye gel ve çorba iç." [Come (to the) inside and drink soup.][ içeri + buffer y + e (to maintain vowel harmony)]

and

Dışarıya gel!" [Come (to the) outside.][ Dışarı + buffer y + a (to maintain vowel harmony)]

In the two examples above, "inside" and "outside" are nouns in the dative case because the meaning is slightly different from “The old woman sees inside,” but I thought it might be helpful for you to see the comparison.

You, however, specifically asked, "Why is it not içinde?" so I want to address that. In examples we have been given where içinde is used, it is similar to the English "prepositional phrase." Because the order of such phrases are reversed in Turkish they call them "postpositional phrases." They consist of a postposition (e.g., in/inside, out/outside, behind, under, …) preceded by a noun. It gets a lot more complicated than that, but for now, let's go back and take a look at some examples found in duolingo's lessons.

Şeker kahvenin içinde. (The sugar is in the coffee.)

Çilek şekerin içinde. (The strawberry is in the sugar.)

In both of the sentences above, the postposition içinde (in/inside of) is preceded by the second part of the phrase -- coffee in the first example and sugar in the second. In English we would call these nouns the "object of the preposition." Genitive case is applied to the noun that links to the postposition because içinde is one of the postpositions that uses a postpositional phrase in this way [için (for) , gibi (like), kadar (up to/until), and ile (with) are others]. So, therefore, we get a sentence construction as the one used in the two sentences above. Kahve becomes kahvenin, şeker becomes şekerin.

My source for some of this information is a resource I think is particularly good. It is called Turkish: A Comprehensive Grammar. You can link to it here: https://goo.gl/2pIUhl.

There's been a few posts that kind of touch on this topic, but sometimes more information can just be more confusing. You can click on the "Discussion" tab and search for any topic you'd like there. It helps if you type in the Turkish word, but if you prefer to use English instead, it might help to also type "Turkish" to limit your results to this language. You may already be doing that, and if so, please just disregard my attempt to be helpful, but if not, you might find it useful.

In the grammar book I refer to in this post, the authors have written “the boundaries between noun, adjective, and adverb are somewhat blurred” in Turkish. Somehow having read that makes trying to learn Turkish a bit less frustrating. Knowing is half the battle, right?

Hope this helped in some way.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/juliacooper

Thanks!! This was was more than I expected, awesome and thorough answer!!! :D


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lisa4duolingo

Glad you appreciated it. Not sure why it was included in this lesson on postpositions. My guess is that someone wanted to show us that a postpositional/prepositional word can also be a noun. I don't think there are a great many of them and in fact, when I go to Tureng's online dictionary, "içeri" as a noun actually means "within."

http://tureng.com/search/i%C3%A7eri

Be that as it may, I found two other "postpositional" words that also serve as nouns -- beyond and outside. Applying this same example to them, you have

Yaşlı kadın öteyi görüyor. (The old woman sees beyond.)

Yaşlı kadın dışı görüyor. (The old woman sees outside.)

Anyway, thanks again for expressing gratitude and best wishes with your study of Turkish.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Arin.Sara

I wish I will know Turkish as you know it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Todd940413

ilgi ve çalışma : )
Çok çok teşekkürler!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Hakim747

Thank you very much. It is really helpful even though I'm still confused. But I'm sure I'll get it soon. This thing is really really really confusing.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Laura847169

Based on the nice and intricate answer above, I am inclined to think that this is one of the beautifully poetic and philosophical phrases that color the Turkish language.. Like, the old woman sees inside - in terms of.. she sees that the inside is more important in a person than the exterior? Which would explain the specification of the woman being old; wisdom comes with age and such?

I'm just guessing here though.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FrancescaP349937

How do you choose which vowel to rhyme with?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/London.CHANEL

Thank you so much, Lisa. You are a very devoted leaener.. I mean teacher, in this case. (May 22 2021 Sat).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Amin.mq

That was really helpful, thank you so much.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zesamsam

Why isn't "is looking inside" an acceptable answer?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/leighozdemir

I think that would be a different verb. "Görmek" is seeing; "bakmak" is looking. Really, it's an odd sentence. I always get it wrong because I picture an old lady peeping in someone's windows ("looking inside"), but really she is seeing the inside of something. If I would pay attention to the verb (to see not to look), I would get it right because when you see something it should take the accusative.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Biene_Maja_16

Do I understand it right? -> "O içeriye görüyor" means "she sees inside of sth." (for example into the house or into a box). And "o içeriyi görüyor" means "she sees the inside" (with inside being a noun, sth. she is metaphoricaly looking at) ???


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mohammed339347

Should be 'görür' sees . Not 'görüyor ' is seeing


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mariana.moh

İ believe "see" is a state verb in english, so we usually use it in the present simple tense, while it seems a normal verb in turkish, so we say "görüyor"...hope it helps :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MsHolanda

My question is why "içeriyi" and not "içeriye" .. ^^' (what would the translation be for the 2nd option) ®


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlexinNotTurkey

You cannot use the dative case (içeriye) here. The verb "görmek" takes the accusative.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pat360646

Oh my goodness I'm confused


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Aywa

Are you feeling less confused now after a year? And if so did the confusion go away with more duolingo or with better outside resources?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MetroWestJP

That should say "the inside," because it's being used as a noun, not as an adverb or preposition.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Stefan923376

I find this remark highly logical. "The old woman sees inside", on the other hand, seems totally ungrammatical and nonsensical to me. I am not a native speaker of English so please correct me if I'm wrong: what is it supposed to mean?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Todd940413

Combining lisa4duolingo's thoughtful comments and AlexinNotTurkey's observation that "'görmek' takes the accusative," I too agree with MetroWestJP that the English translation really should include "the." This may just be another case of a poor English translation put forward as the "correct" one.

As for the grammaticality and sense of "The old woman sees inside" by itself, as an English native, I can say that it is something one might hear. I would say that "inside" is an adverb in this case. It means that the old woman sees something (or some things) inside of whatever it is she's looking into; maybe she sees the floor and some shelves, for example, if she's looking through the window of a store. You might also hear someone say, "Can you see inside?" Answer: "Yeah, I see some tables and chairs." Or maybe, "No, I can't see a thing." So I guess, really, it means "Can you see anything inside?" The verb "see" implies that something is seen; maybe that's why the "something" is omitted here.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Stefan923376

Thank you very much indeed for your time and effort. I can just about see that the English sentence is just about possible, but maybe it would be easier to change it in the first place.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GhassanKha

Why not içi? Is içer different from iç? If they are same then how do we get ER?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/juliacooper

Why is it not "içinde"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/90du5

Should not we use the directive? Like the verb bakmak


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlexinNotTurkey

I think you mean the dative :) And nope, the verb "görmek" takes the accusative.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/90du5

hahaha, yes I mean dative, but I always say directive. thank you for your answer


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SheikhJahb

But the English sentence is, "The old woman sees inside." Doesn't that indicate she's looking at an x-ray or something? She can't see the guts, but she can see all the ball bearings that dude swallowed. If the old woman were a knife weilding maniac, litterally looking at people's guts, then the English sentence would have been, "The old woman sees the insides." and then inside would go in the accusative.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/neesha64

As a native British English speaker I feel 'the old woman is seeing inside' should be accepted. It feels fine, for example, as a response to 'what is the old woman doing?'.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/T.nDr

"Seeing" is continuous, the verb would end in -orum, to be accepted. I rather felt the sentence to be unnatural.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Yomalyn

Continuous present verbs in Turkish end with -iyor + personal ending (and the "i" changes for vowel harmony). So "görüyorum" is specifically 1st person ("I am seeing"), and görüyor is 3rd person ("he/she/it is seeing").

However in English, "to see" is usually treated as a stative verb, so we translate it as simple present: "I see", "she sees", etc. If we use continuous present (ex. "I'm seeing things"), it has different connotations, as though what I'm seeing isn't really there (at least where I'm from!)

But neesha64 was pointing out that maybe this difference in connotation isn't as distinct in the UK, which I'm not qualified to comment on :-)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TGailani

I'm not a native English speaker but, I think the answer to the question would be: "she's looking inside." Because, looking is the controlled action of the body while seeing is the uncontrolled response of the eye.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/senada1205

Can somebody explain please why is içeriyi used instead if içeriye


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Yomalyn

Bana bakıyorsun = you are looking at me
Beni göruyorsun = you see me

içeriye bakıyorum = I am looking (to the) inside
içeriyi göruyorum = I see inside


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AboAyman3

Woul not be better to say: looks inside?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Yomalyn

görmek = to see // bakmak = to look


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/o0Mira0o

Yes, but in terms of the meaning, shouldn't 'look' be used here to make more sense? What does 'see' inside mean? Unless it is meant in a metaphorical sense... (?)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Yomalyn

Oh, I see what you mean (sorry AboAyman if that's what you meant as well and I misunderstood)...

I do like your suggestion that this could be metaphorical... It brings to mind an image of an old woman who sees inside my soul while she's reading my fortune at the bottom of my coffee cup. Haha!

Or it could be more mundane, as in: she sees the inside of her fish tank (because she's finally cleaned the glass).

I completely agree that "looking inside"/"içeriye bakıyor" is more likely to be used in most contexts.... But this could just be Duo's way of introducing us to "içeriyi" as a comparison to "içeriye". :-)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/o0Mira0o

Çok güzel :)

Thank you for elaborating and citing these examples.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/EL-orfi

Long story short, it's içeriyi because it's a noun (the inside) not a descriptive adjective (inside of something). And because it's a noun then it should be in accusative and i is added to içer with a y buffer


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jennie721026

I thought this was icerinde (inside). Why iceriyi?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jennie721026

Why is this “iceriyi” and not “ice riye”?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Amynlharding123

what is the difference between içeriyi and İçeriye


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zeid188584

içeryi is the akkusativ form. (the inside is here the object itself). içerye is the dative form. (you are looking somewhere in the inside)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sara692366

Why we use içer instead of iç? Can't it be içi instead of içeriyi?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jonasklingberg

I am having a really hard time understanding the meaning of this sentence.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/OlavSurlan

The meaning is dependent on the context, and what is the context here? There is none, just single free-standing sentences.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Driekie8

I looked up the different translations separately because I was confused. Google translate said the following : In = içinde Inside = Icerde The inside (diameter) = İçeride Contains = içeriyi according to the above, the iceriyi used is incorrect in this sentence. Could someone please explain?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zeid188584

why looks inside not accepted


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Todd940413

Hi, zeid. Congrats on that streak (currently 914)! Why is "looks inside" not accepted? My thought would be that one may look without seeing (bakmak vs. görmek), as one may listen without hearing (dinlemek vs. duymak).

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