1. Forum
  2. >
  3. Topic: Irish
  4. >
  5. "My friend is down at the bot…

"My friend is down at the bottom of the room."

Translation:Tá mo chara thíos ag bun an tseomra.

June 29, 2015



to me this says "at the bottom room" as opposed to "at the bottom of the room"


Seomra takes the same form in both the nominative and the genitive. It can be identified as genitive in this sentence because it’s a masculine noun, and a definite masculine noun following an that begins with S + vowel gets a prefixed T only in the genitive. Thus, bun an tseomra means “the bottom of the room”.


I can see it now... it will stick eventually :P


I got it right but don't know how. I still couldn't get the difference between sios and thios.


thíos is a position or location, síos is a direction of motion.


The literal English sounds bizarre to me... is the sense of this something like "...at the [other] end of the room"?


The English sentence has "at the bottom of the room". The Irish sentence has only one article. Would "ag an mbun an tseomra" be wrong here? Doesn't the Irish sentence given above mean "at the bottom of a room?


Definite Genitive phrases only have one definite article in Irish, and it occurs between the nouns, not before the first one. ag bun an tseomra means "at the bottom of the room", fáinne geal an lae means "the dawning of the day", i lár na páirce means "in the middle of the field".

Remember that these English genitive phrases can also be restated as "the room's bottom" or "the day's dawning" or "the field's middle", where you only have one definite article.


Go raibh maith agat, these genitive phrases are still a bit difficult for me. How would one say "in the middle of a field" or "at the bottom of a room"? I am just trying to get my head around it.


i lár páirce or ag bun seomra


Use of the two definite articles ("an") isn't accepted, for the reasons SatharnPHL explains below. But if you write "ag mbun an tseomra," Duolingo will accept the eclipsed form ("mbun"). [Edited to add:] Duolingo does say that "mbun" is a typo. I'm not advanced enough in Irish to know why "bun" is not eclipsed after "ag" in this sentence. Hopefully one of the experts will weigh in on this point.


The preposition ag only causes eclipsis when it is followed by an and then the singular noun. This is also true of other prepositions like ar, leis, roimh, trid, um...


What do thios sios .... mean? We can only try at random


What is the difference between thíos and anúas?


thíos is a position - Tá sé thíos i bpoll - "He's down in a hole", Tá sé thíos faoin talamh - "It's (down) under the ground".

anuas (no fada) indicates motion - ag teacht anuas ón díon - "coming down from the roof", Leag anuas ar an mbord é - "set it down on the table".

Learn Irish in just 5 minutes a day. For free.