What she means is that previously we were told that "al" means in the. So by all logic "crema al cioccolato" would mean "cream in the chocolate". Which does indeed sound a little weird. Duolingo SHOULD have given us an example or told us somehow that when you put those words together it makes the word "chocolate cream", but it didn't so this is a little unfair.
I understand what you are saying but it could hardly be considered to be unfair. I think of Duolingo as a very useful tool, a free tool, that can be used in one's quest to learn other languages. It is not a total solution by any means. After you reach level 25 you are just beginning your journey.
Actually, they have. Look at the explanation given below the 6 lessons of the FOOD section. Al implies that the dish TASTES LIKE the ingredient. So "Crema al cioccolato" is the Cream which tastes like chocolate. Similarly "Gelato al cioccolato" is the Ice cream which tastes like chocolate (OR the ice cream flavored with chocolate).
Exactly; why i was corrected then because i used the word "cream" instead of "custard"? Custard!
Have you ever had Boston creme pie? What we call "creme" there is closer to "custard". There are some foods that, for historical reasons, still use "cream/creme" to describe what today most people would call "custard".
The Italian "crema" refers to that "cream/custard". "Panna" is "cream" like what one pours in one's coffee.
Custard!!! They should be changing the letter C with B !! I hate this sentence I swear.
i would agree that is it is confusing, but it is just one of those nuances you have to pick up on as you learn the language.
As a 56 year old native english speaker I have NEVER heard the phrase 'chocolate cream'. What you googled is chocolate icing, made with cream, but it is NOT called chocolate cream.
Chocolate cream is not the same as chocolate icing. A cream can be a dessert by itself, while also be used for icing a cake. Is more simmilar to a chocolate musse than a chocolate icing.
Are you saying that there are places in the world where chocolate cream is eaten as a dessert? In america, cream, the heavy stuff skimmed from the top of fresh milk is primarily an ingredient, or it is whipped to make whipped cream which is used as a topping. My point is that the duo lingo translation into English is simply wrong. There is no such thing as 'chocolate cream' in English. There is mousse, custard, pudding, filling, icing, ice cream, but one cannot go to the store or a restaurant and find something called 'chocolate cream'.
I think your point is perfect but highlights the void between languages. Simply, the translations often exist literally because of cultural difference.
Coffee in Italy is a good example. Latte is simply milk - not milk coffee. Caffe is I think espresso and so on. There are no true translations for all things - only best description which may differ as you learn to translate things for yourself as time goes on.
Um I can buy cartons of it in Australia. To just whip up and put on top of fruit or ice cream (or to eat on its own...).
The real translation in this case is "' chocolate mousse" and it is not I eat, it is I am eating chocolate mousse. There is a difference.
That's cuz Brits are not exactly famous for good cooking or baking ;) It's perfectly normal in Estonia (where I come from) where people love any kind of creamy dessert. Sometimes things on Duolingo have to be back translated into English if they don't exist in England https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=sokolaadikreem&client=ubuntu&hs=M0&channel=fs&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjTxIPnzrTOAhVkOMAKHZl-CFUQ_AUICSgC
I think the "chocolate cream" it says is the filling in between cookies/cakes (chocolate cream filled cupcake)
Apparently its chocolate custard... Although duolingo never said crema was custard...
Why say the "al" at all? Why not just Io mangio crema cioccolato if the english term is simply I eat chocolate cream?
because Italian is not translating from English! In Italian you say "crema al cioccolato". Furthermore, they interchange the word cioccolato with other words to describe other types of cream. Consequently, translation of these terms has to be done specifically and with thought about an equivalent.
Because its different in Italian. Just like in Spanish, you would say "crema de chocolate", not "crema chocolate". It's just grammar rules.
I totally agree with you, but I am still a bit confused about it all. (for a nine year old that has been learning it for ages.)
Why in most cases is it strongly emphasised to pay attention to the articles in Italian sentences but the translation back to English is somewhat generalised?
For instance in this particular sentence "Io mangio la crema al cioccolato". You can understand from the sentence that there is a specific chocolate cream that we are talking about (because of the 'la'), or a selection of different tastes and I am declaring that "I eat the chocolate cream", but at the same time the correct answer from the answers selection is "I eat chocolate cream" which is just a general statement about my taste preferences. Should it not be "Io mangio crema al cioccolato", or it will not make any sense?
Italian adds the article in a lot of places where English doesn't, so "Io mangio crema al cioccolato" would be incorrect. However, "I eat chocolate cream" is awkward English (though correct), the best translation is "I eat the chocolate cream", for the reasons you said. Normally English people will say "I like chocolate cream", "I like eating chocolate cream", I am eating chocolate cream", "I often eat chocolate cream" depending on the situation, rather than the awkward phrasing Duolingo used.
It doesn't make sense anyway. You eat chocolate cream, you don't eat to it.
great to read the Duolingo note attached to the word cream: verb cremate! - perhaps they are hinting at death by chocolate...?
so what does the "al" mean? Chocolate IN the cream? or cream In the chocolate? Could you also say "I eat the cream in the chocolate"? or could it be "I eat the chocolate in the cream?"
There isn't really any "in" implied; sure, chocolate is usually an ingredient in a chocolate cream/custard, but it could be just cocoa as well. A+article+noun in Italian usually expresses "how" something is made, e.g. "essere alla moda" (to be fashionable), "pantaloni alla zuava" (Zouave-style pants, i.e. knickerbockers); when talking about food it usually refers to their flavor, e.g. "tè al limone" (lemon tea) or "gnocchi al pesto" (gnocchi with pesto sauce).
Well, I try to remember that this is a free app. They are giving us one wonderful language tool here for nothing. I don't think it would hurt us to look things up. There are resources galore all over the internet for us to clarify things we don't understand. Plus we have this comments section where we can help each other out.
Lingot for your explanation. It's exactly what I needed to understand this sentence. Thank you very much. :)
When a food uses "con", it's simply a matter of "this with that", rather similar to "food with X" in English. It's simply an item that's included.
When a food uses "al", it means that's the flavor of it. We say "flavor food" like "chocolate cake" and they say "food to the flavor" like "torta al cioccolato". If it were a major ingredient, it would be "food of ingredient". We say "carrot cake" and they say "torta di carote".
"Al" takes a different meaning when used for a dish. Al means that the dish tastes like the ingredient. So "crema la cioccolato" means the cream 'which tastes like' chocolate. Also, "in the" is "Nello" or one of its conjugations. Al usually means "to the".
I wouldn't call "nello" or "al" a conjugation, or a declension for that matter. Verbs conjugate, nouns decline, and this is simply a contraction of a preposition with a definite article.
so "al" can be used to turn a word into an adjective, like chocolate is describing the cream?
Sort of. If it helps to use that as a mnemonic, go ahead.
In English (a Germanic language), we have the ability to put two nouns together to form a phrase where the first noun acts like an adjective: orange juice, for example, means "juice that is made from oranges". But in Romance (Latinate) languages like Italian and its sister language Spanish, you can't say things like "naranja jugo" but rather must say things like "jugo de naranja".
The sentence caught me off guard. The only thing i could think of that would be chocolate cream and not chocolate mouse or chocolate icing would be chocolate pastry cream.
Just as you could walk into a store and order a white or a Boston cream donut., some rare places you could order a chocolate cream donut.
I hate this level, poorly translated. They keep switching words "cream chocolate" or "chocolate cream" or " chocolate ice cream".
The best literal translation of "crema al cioccolato" is "chocolate cream," although the best idiomatic translation is "chocolate custard."
Di means that the dish has only that one ingredient (Eg: Lemon juice) , whereas Al means that the dish TASTES like that one ingredient (Eg: chocolate ice cream). It may be confusing because if a dish has only one ingredient, it should taste like it, so there shouldn't be a difference!! But that's the way it is. And it is possible to use any one of the two, if there is no room for confusion anyway. It depends on the dish and the way it is made.
Does the al part change to alla if the ingredient is feminine? For example if it was strawberry cream (if such a thing existed) would it be la crema alla fragola?
Rae, thanks for that. I understand the articulated preposition but I wanted to check that the AL isn't just a random word used when it comes to food.
No, it's not random. Whether it's being used literally or idiomatically, it follows the same rules.
Some cremes are called custard. Like Boston creme pies or éclairs are said to be creme-filled, but given the consistency, that's a custard.
What The English call custard, yellow and a bit thicker. Although some like it runny and hot. Or even the consistency of cream. But cream is cream, and custard is custard.
This is confusing--not because I don't understand the translation, but because they keep telling me it's wrong and changing the answer. The first time I answered "I eat chocolate ice cream", which it counted wrong and said that the correct answer was 'I eat chocolate custard'--the next time it came around I answered "I eat chocolate custard", which was counted wrong and corrected to "I eat chocolate gellato". The third time (you can see where this is going to go) I answer with the previous correction, which was then counted wrong and corrected to "I eat chocolate ice cream" -_- really. REALLY.
I remember being taught that "crema" was a false cognate, and in fact means something more like custard or sauce more generally. Is this not the case? Can "crema" be used for actual cream?
Though, since chocolate custard is a real thing, unlike chocolate cream, whatever that is supposed to be, that would make the sentence actually make sense.
It's actually more like chocolate custard. It's often used as a pastry filling (think éclaires).
does it matter which way around the last part of the sentence is could you also say "Io mangio la cioccolato al crema" and still be correct ?
"Panna" refers specifically to milk fat (the term is defined somewhat strictly by the Italian laws), while "crema" can refer to a number of things, not all of which called "cream" in English. "Whipped cream" is "panna montata", but "whiskey cream" is "crema di whiskey".
Would it be incorrect to translate this to "I eat (the) cream of chocolate"? If so, then it would be great if the system accepted it; if not, can someone explain why? Thanks.
I've learned to use "di" in this case instead of "al" like crema di cafe, which would mean cream of coffee. I dont know why i get marked wrong for it when it's righr as well!!
Wow! Well, this was something different... My first language isnt english so its a bit hard...
Really? I got a fail for spelling "cioccolato" incorrectly, when the structure was correct?
In early questions al was expressly at the and here totally sth else, so how to determine and solely 3 heart for this tough chapter
This is confusing to me. Their explanation of al doesn't really compute for me. It must be a nuance of the language.
Why do they use "al" here if it means "to the" / "at the"? I believe it should not be necessary to use it here.
Saying "it should not be necessary" means you're trying to apply the rules of English to Italian, and it just doesn't work that way. That's the idiom in Italian, and we just need to accept it and move on.
a + il. "il" is one of the singular masculine words for "the".
ai would be
a + i. "i" is another singular masculine word for "the".
la is the singular feminine word for "the".
Sad that I typed "cream chocolate" but got it wrong as chocolate cream. Was my translation truly wrong or was DuoLingo strict for the exact translation?
I've never heard of "cream chocolate". There's "cream of chocolate", but that's not the same as "chocolate cream". "Chocolate cream" is indeed the appropriate translation.
That's just how Italian works. English says "flavor food" and Italian says "food [at the] flavor".
Unless it literally means the particular flavour of the cream which is chocolate rather than a specific food or cream.
a means to L means the, therefore together, al means to the. so the whole would be I eat to the cream . I have several things that do not relate, so how can we get it right if we have no knowledge of these differences.
This is where you're learning it.
Different languages work differently, they don't just use different words. In English, we say "flavor food" but in Italian they say "food to/at the flavor". Be careful about the difference between "flavored as" and "made with" though. In Italian, "made with" uses "of (di)".
English: chocolate cream
Italian: crema al cioccolato
English: vanilla ice cream
Italian: gelato alla vaniglia
English: carrot cake
Italian: torta di carote
This is how they teach it to you.
(If you only use the mobile app, you really should check out the website version. There are often explanations before it gets into the quizzes.)
Am I the only one who translated crema al cioccolato as cream at the chocolate? lol
No Ninyabella, I did as well. Being that "A" translates as, to and La or L, Translates as The. "Therefore to the cream would more precisely translate to, " At the cream", to my way of seeing it.
No two languages ever map their vocabulary perfectly one to one, and this goes triple for prepositions.
a in Italian could just as easily be
at in English, depending on how it's used.
The "Al" means that the DISH TASTES LIKE THE INGREDIENT. So "crema al cioccolato" is the cream 'which tastes like' chocolate (If there IS a product like this....maybe it's in something designed like a Shaving Cream Can). The "al" TAKES A DIFFERENT MEANING when used for a dish, but usually it means "To the". It is explained below the 6 lessons in FOOD section.
I noticed that the grammar is not the same :( It will be hard, real hard...
It took me a while but my advice is to try and not literally translate languages word for word. You probably do it already and don't realise. Take Buongiorno for example. This means Good day but you probably recognize this as hello without a 2nd thought. When things are different I just treat it as trying to learn different codes. Also there's no point saying why does Italian do it like that. Italian is an older language than English so why should they change their day to day language to suit ours
I am not sure that there is any such thing as chocolate cream, we need to find out what this actually is in order to get the best translation, my inial thoughts were that this was really hot chocolate
"la" is a feminine article so does that mean only females say la cream al cioccolato while males say "il crema al cioccolato"?
No. Grammatical gender (also called noun classes) is mostly arbitrary and mostly has nothing to do with physical sex.
The feminine article is used because, like all adjectives, it must agree with the noun it goes with. "Crema" is a feminine noun, therefore it takes feminine adjectives, articles, and possessives.
Both men and women say "La crema è la mia" to mean "the cream is mine" because it must all agree with the noun "crema" and not the speaker.
Both men and women say "il cioccolato è il mio" to mean "the chocolate is mine" because it must all agree with the noun "cioccolato" and not the speaker.
It literally means "to/at the".
But different languages have different ways of saying things. English says "flavor food" like "cherry ice cream" or "vanilla cake". Italian says "food to the flavor" like "crema al cioccolato".
As a 74 year old native Englishman l have never heard the words custard and chocolate juxtaposed in any way. Learn Italian to explore your own language in this instance English. Mmm, chocolate custard, I'll experiment!
I said chocolate ice cream and it said I was wrong, it's chocolate custard, but aren't ice cream and custard basically the same thing? (I know technically custard has eggs and ice cream doesn't, but with context, people know which you're talking about)
Ice cream is "gelato".
Custard is more similar to pudding and holds its form at room temperature.
Ice cream is frozen and will melt if it gets warm.
why is this chocolate custard when Lui mangia la crema al cioccolato is he eats chocolate ice cream?
Chocolate cream, you mean: ice cream is gelato. In Italian many types of creamy substances are "crema", with the exception of milk cream, which is "panna". Custard is technically "crema pasticciera", but it's commonplace to call it just crema.
Since when is cream 'custard'? Judging by the comments, the answer was changed.
Ok so I answered chocolate cream but it was wrong because suddenly its chocolate custard... like what???
We call it "custard", they call it "crema".
We call it "cream", they call it "panna".
Would anyone else agree that Duo's fixation with 'crema al cioccolato' is a bit disproportionate to its actual frequency/usefulness? I mean, how often do you really eat chocolate custard (or chocolate creme patisserie, whichever it actually is)? We are taught "cioccolato" in plenty of other contexts (e.g. biscuits, ice-cream); and "panna" is a much more common/useful word for cream anyway! Sorry for this rant, but it really does come up too often!!
A native Italian speaker told me crema means hand creme not cream like from milk
It's about the texture and consistency. It also refers to custard. Cream for milk is panna.
And yet they accepted "I eat the chocolate cream". After reading the answer and then comments, i don't even know which is right.
There are a few things going on here:
- The difference between how Italian is actually spoken and how Duolingo teaches Italian.
- Enough people reporting an issue that the team has added in a new answer. Refer to the first point.
Its not recognising that I've actually translated it correctly and won't move on
I had been a little confused by the term (because I thought it meant ice cream, and some people on here said it was frosting). Judging by a Google Images search of "crema al cioccolato," it's a custard or pudding, which can be eaten alone with a spoon.
Yeah, "crema" is more like pudding or the kind of custard you fill donuts with. "Panna" is more like the cream you put into your coffee. "Gelato" is ice cream.
we may know, but don't understand it's logic, therefore sets up confusion, and we have not learned anything, only become aware of the complication for beginners, in Italian. the things in English, which are confusing to italians, I understand because I know the etymology of the word or phrase, which we do not in Italian.
Because different languages have different rules. It's not a one-to-one calque of English.
It sounded like mangia to me we should not be penalized for her poor pronunciations
But you should know that "io" can only be "mangio" and that "mangia" can only be "lui/lei".
Yes, and her voice trails off at a lot of endings, and makes nigh impossible for me to hear what the is.
What in a world is a chocolate custard. I'm a fish and chips dude, Duo, not a fillet mignooon one.
The fact that there is a third word should at this point in the tutorial be represented with an English word. Something like, "cream OF chocolate" and then it also accepts "chocolate cream"
Well, just because you can use a certain type of phrase in certain languages doesn't mean that it's appropriate in others... and the point of the site is to train you in the actual Italian, not a weird pidgin based on English.
Would you like a site to teach English to an Italian using such constructions as "house of birds" or "cream of ice"? These may get their point across but they instantly mark you as not a native speaker.
So what is the actual translation for "la crema al cioccolato" in english? Because there is no such thing as "chocolate cream" in english. There is chocolate cream pie, chocolate cream icing, chocolate ice cream, chocolate milk, but I challenge you to find me a product in the grocery store that is called "chocolate cream". So as you said, using the phrase (in english) "chocolate cream" marks one as a non-native speaker. I would still like to know if there is such a thing as "la crema al cioccolato" in Italy, and if so what is it called in english. I assume it is just a computer generated phrase to teach Italian with no regard to actual practical usage.
I think what confuses it all is the logic of the wording, or phrasing. as someone else said, a=to and L La + the. al = to the or at the. now I'm confusing myself.
Oh definitely, although most people will have tried a café au lait, a chou à la crème, a pie à la mode, a pasta alla bolognese or alla carbonara: they simply never bothered understanding the grammar.
What ntkonn is saying, however, is that "cream" in English typically means milk fat ("panna" in Italian), so "chocolate cream" isn't common (Cadbury does market it, but as chocolate filled with cream); however as a google search easily confirms "chocolate cream" does exist, and indeed it's often whipped cream flavoured or mixed with chocolate to form some kind of mousse. Something Italians would call "crema al cioccolato" (or mousse). But it's also true that "crema al cioccolato" usually refers to chocolate custard, and "crema di cioccolato" to a chocolate spread.
I believe this phrase refers, not so much to the cream but to the biscuit, chocolate cream. And I would think most of us are familiar with them. Saying that, it still confuses me, because all a means to the. If it's to be the, why not use Il or la
at the chocolate, or to the chocolate, as I see it. But I take it literately, to mean what it is saying. I don't see any such, ambiguity in English, or is that perhaps because I speak English as my first language.
a does not mean "to/at the". It just mean "to/at". It is just a preposition. There is no article included.
a + il, which is "to/at the", using (one of) the singular masculine "the".
And there is no point in taking foreign languages word-for-word to your native language, because different languages are not merely word substitutions. They have different histories and different structures. You just need to learn that in Italian, "[food] to the [ingredient/flavor]" is how they say "[ingredient/flavor] [food]". So "vanilla cake" is "torta alla vaniglia".
I often get a warning that there is no sound on the first item in a section. It sometimes goes away if I reload the page. (You're never penalized for starting over at the very first item, after all.) If you're getting this AFTER the first item, then I can't help you, sorry!